Wastegate: Internal or External

[Robbie-87plz]

Been doing some reading and for some reason am not coming up with an answer that suits me.
1. What's the difference between the external/internal wastegate?
2. What's the better one for a given goal? (i.e. mid 10's-mid 11's, mid 11's-mid 12's,...e.t.c.)
3. What's the best one out there that you've personally owned? (i.e. fit, finish..)

Thanks for the help. Some of you are wondering why I didn't use a search button. As in everything, someone develops a new product, new experiences, e.t.c.

 

[Boost231]

Currenlty i run a internal wastegate on my Turbo Buick. I have had no problems running it this way and i have run a external on the car at one point in time. as far as external i love Tial Gates there awsome period. I run a Tial gate on my Turbo Gsxr600 i would never run a internal on that type of setup. i know its a bike but it all depends on what your goals are. There are some sweet internal setups like the RJC setup that you can go easy 9's with and im sure 8's with the right setup.

 

[Dreamcar86]

Internal is the factory setup where the wastegate is on the turbo. The external is one that you can mount to the exhaust manifold or downpipe.
As far as what way to go you can accomplish the same thing with both. There are factory boost wastegates and there are heavy duty ones that you can upgrade to. The external will offer different springs that you can change out to achieve higher boost levels.
What are your current mods? Going external is not cheap and there may be other things you would want to purchase before making this step.

 

[Robbie-87plz]

Dreamcar-I figured it would be more expensive. I'm currently in the mind frame of purchasing parts once. So I was asking what you guys were running, and what power levels the WG are good for. My car, pretty much stock, just getting an idea on what direction to take...
Thanks for the replies so far guys.

 

[bsdlinux]

I've always had more consistant boost using an external gate. My GN has an ATR DeltaGate...love it The daily driver T has stock turbo with internal gate, works good but the boost can move on me a little at times.

 

[thenash79]

I was always told an externial gate could control higher boost much better,also once u get into the larger turbos don't u loose the room needed for a huge puck.is there a such thing as a 4 bolt internal wastgate turbo?

 

[GNVYUS 1]

After spending time in both the GN world an import world I would say that the GN is the luckiest factory turbo car to have a great functioning internal gate. Many have successfully used the internal with 70mm turbos with little ill effects. I don't see the reason for an external on a GN with stockish headers/DP until you are past the 70mm turbo's in power and want to run low boost around town or get super solid boost levels.

An external has very few functional downsides unless it is leaking due to flange issues, springs, hose issues etc. Usually cost and downpipe plumbing are the main reasons few use them on GN's.

I have a Tial on my import and it works great, but there are many wastegates now in the market so Tial is no longer the only reliable game in town.

 

[Robbie-87plz]

So a 3.5" SS DP internal WG would be sufficient for getting in the low 11's?
And for those aiming lower than 10's would be maybe external??

 

[Boost231]

the 3.5 ss dp with internal gate will be more then enough for low 11's i would start looking into a external gate around the 9's

 

[bsdlinux]

the 3.5 ss dp with internal gate will be more then enough for low 11's i would start looking into a external gate around the 9's

Agreed. The only reason my GN has an external ATR gate, is that I bought it that way

 

[Robbie-87plz]

Awesome...
So far, I've read that the suppliers for those are:
g-bodyparts
(the ghost of) Terry Houston 3.5"
TIG Masters
GN1 Performance
And as always, someone comes out with it doesn't fit, the loyals retaliate by saying it's your 'mounts, and the fight ensues. Just give me straight facts....
What's the best best for an eventual 6776 and low 11's high 10's? Mahalo (Hawaiian for Thank you)

 

[bison]

I voted external since the ability to control an external with aftermarket electronics and and CO2 cant be touched by any of the swing valve type internal gates available. This would be for a car running in the 10's or faster minimum though or requiring superb boost control with ramp up and lunch boost etc. For at least 95% of us going slower than 11.00 there is no need for an external and the cost to do so could be spent on other more important things. But like i said if you require precise control you will need an external. Some might not be aware of the electronics available to control gates these days but there is some really great stuff available today. Ive had great luck with t-netics racegates myself. They work into the low 9's on a single gate.

 

[KevinB]

So a 3.5" SS DP internal WG would be sufficient for getting in the low 11's?
And for those aiming lower than 10's would be maybe external??

My car has a 3" dp with an internal wg. Seems to work ok for now. I'd like to get a 3.5" dp with the internal wg but it's hard to find one when you have atr headers. So far my car has had a few 9 second passes and many low 10 second passes.

 

[bison]

So a 3.5" SS DP internal WG would be sufficient for getting in the low 11's?
And for those aiming lower than 10's would be maybe external??

There is little real world gain putting a 3.5" dp on a car that is going under 130mph in the quarter. Availability and initial cost make it a no go unless you get a deal on a used one. One good thing about internally gated stainless dp's is that they are easy to sell and retain most of their value when used. There was a 3" dp internally gated dp in the parts for sale section that was around $300. That is a great deal that could be taken advantage of and say in 2 years you want to go external you could get the $300 back when selling to put towards your external and new dp. For those wanting to go in the 9's they shouldnt even waste their time on the 3 bot turbos unless required to by class rules. The 4 bolt design is a much better choice and will make more power. Most will have aftermarket headers by then anyway and 4 bolt doesnt cost any more than 3 bolt unless there is extra bungs/flanges welded on them and even then its not much more. Much more exhaust flow on the 4 bolt tangential housings and much more power potential for a given compressor wheel when run in 4 bolt configuration.

 

[Dreamcar86]

So a 3.5" SS DP internal WG would be sufficient for getting in the low 11's?
And for those aiming lower than 10's would be maybe external??

I am running low 11's with a 3" DP, 6152 turbo, stock intercooler, internal wastegate, ALKY and of course 91 octane.

The only reason I asked the questions earlier is because you can spend your money in better places to make power. As stated above I have seen HD internal actuators run 9's. If you are going with a 76 trim turbo you might want to look into intercoolers, ALKY, heads, etc. to get better power adders.

 

[Robbie-87plz]

It's all a dream right now man. I'm building this car up from a clean slate. And I've seen others buy parts only to run into a bottle neck later. Hence me trying to educate myself through asking the experience Buford faithful.

BTW, I sent you a PM-dreamcar.