What table controls ...

[96SCTA]

When i mash the gas down real fast my car falls on its face and almost dies. It dont matter what gear im in or what rpm. Any quick movment of the gas peddel and it almost dies. When i loged this i found that the kpa's would jump striaght up the charts but no rpm increase. All the ve numbers are dead nuts on. What table do i need to adjust to fix this problem. Thanks

Micah

 

[Ricky Trussell]

Is it getting too much fuel and bogging?? Does it clean out or do you have to let up?



Check your AE VS Tps Rate of change and your AE VS Map rate of change.

 

[RickWI]

Did you log the A/F ratio? since you did not say it backfired through the throttle body my best guess is it is dead rich, that would be tuned out with your map based accel enrichment, at least that is where I would start. I'd take everything to zero and see what happens. Although things would have to be pretty screwed up also look at your timing table and make sure you have some advance dialed in, in those KPA cells.

 

[96SCTA]

Ricky- I think it is loading up , i have to let off the gas peddeal then slowly get back into it.

AE FUEL VS MAP RATE OF CHANGE

AE FUEL VS TPS RATE OF CHANGE

I dont understand these tables at all. My tps table looks like a an L. Starts off at 4.0 pulse width at zero. And then at 1 tps rate of change drops to .04. Then it slowly goes back up and ends at 2.0 pusle width at 15 tps rate of change. Good bad . i dont know.

As for my my map rate table. Starts off at 0 ,0. AnD SlOWLY goes up to and ends at 5.6 added pusle width at 31 map rate.

RickWI - I did log my air fuel. The set point for the cells it crossed were some where between 12-13 af. But my actual droped down to 9.1. And the ve tables are fine. No o2 corrections. I have something like 25-30 degrees of timming in those.
And yes things are pretty messed up with the tunning right now. Im a rookie and trying to work my way through this.
Your guys helps is invaluable. Thanks

Micah

 

[Ricky Trussell]

I don't think 4.0 should be at zero at all should be low number at 0 then taper up. then level off.

Do this:

1) set your AE vs TPS rate of change at .4 at 0 tps taper up to 1.6 at 15tps.

2) AE vs MAP rate of change set to 0 at 0 taper to 3.0 at 31

3) look at you AE vs TPS position it should start at 100 in the top left and taper DOWN to -20 at 21 tps position then maybe level off some but continue down. This does not look right but it is the way it should look.

This should get you to where you don't bog bad but you will still need to tune more.

 

[96SCTA]

ok i have everything set as you recomended. And ill take her for a drive in a few hours. One last question on the ae fuel vs tps postion how low should the number go, Mine looks like this right now.

100 at 0
72.5 at 7
45.1 at 14
20 at 21
20 at 29
-71 the rest of the way.

 

[Ricky Trussell]

All of the settings that I have given you are just a place to start. The AE vs TPS position to me is a weird graph. But as your engine gets to turning rpm's it needs little or no AE fuel so that is why the taper down is steep.

My settings at 21 tps is 0 then -40 at 29tps. But again this should get you to where you engine does not fall and stay there.

Don't forget that you always need to save a file that you have and then make changes.


NOTE: I just noticed your name, 96SCTA. I ASSume that means supercharged trans am?? If this is true I don't know how much AE fuel changes with a boosted engine so make sure you give yourself plenty of room for your 02 to add fuel, but limit how much it takes out to say 5% just to be safe.

 

[96SCTA]

Yes the car is a 96 ta . Superchared. Im running 8lbs of boost.
I went for a ride last night and at first the car would not start. I had to change the tps position back to where it was. For some reasone it likes it there. Once i got her going i stabed the gas and it still has some hesitation but it is alot better. So now i think i just need to fine tune the ae vs tps and ae vs map. The only thing that was strange is that the car kept stalling out on me now. When ever i get off the gas real quick and put it into neuteral. I think i need to adjust the tps vs iac up higher and also adjust my idel parameters so the iac can react faster. What do you think.

I cant wait to get this thing tuned up. My buddie has a 11.3 second ta that i am going to eat alive. Thanks for you help

Micah

 

[Ricky Trussell]

When you say it would not start and you set the tps back, what graph did you change??

If it is not starting you need to check your cranking fuel table to see if you have enough fuel enrichment. If it will not crank hold the pedal down like you would when a carb has flooded an engine. If it cranking you have too much cranking fuel.

If it is cranking and then die you need more afterstart vs CTS put in at the cranking temp.

If your car is a stick you will need to raise your throttle follower higher so when you let off the gas it lets the engine come down slower and not stall. My car is an auto so I have my throttle follower at 10 all the way across pretty much.

When you drive your car after it is warmed up, push the pedal down hard and see if it hesitates. If it does take some more fuel enrichment out of the AE vs TPS position.

Good luck!!!

 

[96SCTA]

I had to change the tps position graph. Becasue my car when it is at idel is at 14 tps points. So when i try and crank it over it auto jumed right to the middle of the graph where there was to much ae.

When i try and start it , it cranks starts then dies. I have to do this 3 times then the car will start and idle.

I changed my IAC D GAIN. I brought it up to 8 and now it does not stall as bad from part throtal to nothing. Next I will adjust my throtal follower upward to see if that helps.

When i drove it and mashed it the car still has some hesitation and now smells like it is very rich. So we are making progress. I will take some more ae away. Only problem is any time I mess with my tps position the car idel and start up gets all messed up. Can i just take it out of of ae vs tps rate of change.

Thanks for your help bro....

 

[Ricky Trussell]

Lets make sure you and I are on the same page.

I don't understand the tps and the car not cranking statement.
When your car idles warm it has a TPS number, whatever it is you need to set your " max tps for idle" one or two numbers above that. What graph are you changing??


If your car is dieing right after you crank it you need more "afterstart vs CTS". Move the line up some where the engine temp is at when this happens,then wait till the engine is cold again to try it. This is a slow process for this adjustment.

1) AE vs TPS position--- This is where you will get the hesitation out by lowering the amout of enrichment. It should not have anything to do with idle.

 

[96SCTA]

My car at idel has 15 pts pf tps. I have the my max tps for idel set at 16.

Even when the car is cold as soon as i start it the tps points goes right to 15 pts on the tps postion graph. I think that when it does this it is to much enrichment for idel. Do i have somthing messed up somewhere else that may make this mess up my start up. Or am i just being a retard.

Maybe i need to do somthing so the tps is reading zero at idel. What do you think.

 

[Ricky Trussell]

You are no retard...... I like this controller but the learning curve without a good manual is not easy.

In the AE vs TPS position graph, it will show your idle tps, mine is set at +20 at 14 tps which is in the middle of the graph. My idle tps is also 14.

This should have nothing to do with your idle or your cranking.

On cranking you get
1) cranking fuel
2) afterstart enrichment
3) AE fuel vs CTS
4) A/F ratio after temp setting is reached

If it is cranking quickly but then stalling you know your cranking fuel is okay. I would add to the afterstart before I cranked it next time.

When the engine is warm (180) look at the throttle follower graph to see where it is running. If it is above your setting(10) then open your throttle blade a little to lower it. This sounds wrong but it closes your IAC.
Check your idle speed vs coolant to make sure you match your setting for idle speed. Then check your VE table to see if your 02 is correcting to match your idle A/F setting. If it is then you can make changes to your VE table to get your correction down to about 1-3%.


If your idle was jumping around it should not be now unless you are lean.

Is it possible for you to sent me a .gct file and I can look to see if something is bad off??

 

[96SCTA]

I sent you a copy of the file im running. Let me know if you see anything way off. And thanks for your help.

Micah

 

[Ricky Trussell]

you have mail.

 

[Ricky Trussell]

You also have a private messege on this board. call between now and 1:30.

 

[96SCTA]

Sorry dude i just woke up. I missed the 1.30 dead line. So tell me did you find anything messed up. I Made a few changes to the profile. I think the car is to lean.

 

[96SCTA]

where did you send the email. I only got the private message.
my email address is Micah_Fuoco@mksinst.com. The yahoo one i dont use anymore.

 

[Ricky Trussell]

I replied to the mail you sent me. I will post here.

I would work on the things below first since cranking is the first thing you do. Then drive the car till it get warm. Cold cranking will be slow tuning unless you just hit it right. Once it is cranked twice quickly it is warm enough to run usually.

You need to log some. Set your log up and log easy driving for a few times. Make sure you log BPW, 02 correction, actual A/F ratio.

Where do you think you are lean at?
What is your 02 doing?

Looking at your set up a couple of things stand out.
1) throttle follower looks to be too high at idle (14 tps) you have it at 59. Is there a reason you have it this high at idle?? This would have your IAC open too much I think at idle. This would make you close your throttle blades to get your idle speed setting. The follower is to let your engine slowly idle down when you push the clutch in instead of stalling. I have mine at 10 at my idle tps .... but I have an auto trans. I know you will need more at higher TPS position than me. Is your engine slow to come down after you push the clutch in??

2) since the engine is dieing right after start raise your afterstart fuel up to 32 at cold thru 100 degrees then taper to 15 and then level off. this should help the engine run right after start. You have -4 when the engine is warm. this could make the engine with heat soak surge when you crank it warm. Have you had this??

3) What is your cam specs? Unless it is large you should be able to idle less than 880 rpm when the engine is warm. This could be because your IAC is too open at idle.

Other than that you could smooth out your cold crank fuel some. I would not make much change to it if the engine cranks pretty quick without you touching the throttle.

 

[96SCTA]

ok, I have lots of changes to make. Making lots of good progress. Ill keep making the adjustments you have sujested. Then ill get a few good logs. And we will go from there.

My cam is a 224/232 580/580.

I will get back to you some time this weekend.
Thanks

Micah