I just got done using some mcquires black gold or something, the liquid one that comes in a box. It sucks compared to old turtle wax. In the right light. I can still see the outline of the water spots from last time it got wet, and its over all not as shiney/glossy. Maybe it needs a couple coats or something. Do I need some cleaner wax or something? What have you found works good on these black cars. So far turtle wax has been the best for me.