Whats the best timing set up belt/chain/gear for Stage 2 engines

[Nasty Wendy]

with solid roller cams? Looking for the pros and cons of whatever is available. I'd like to have EVERYTHING (as usual) durability, strength, quiet. I'd like to keep a working knock sensor if possible but I can be talked out of it. Thanks in advance for the help/opinions/facts.

 

[Nasty Wendy]

I should have said that I want to try having a working knock sensor but I can be talked out of trying it. The solid cam will be a hurdle for that I know.

 

[Nasty Wendy]

Anybody know the part number for the Danny B belt drive kit used for Buick on-center stage2s? Is it a kit or a pieced together deal?

 

[GARY HARVEY]

A good chain works well for all around situations. Sending it and the gear set off to get cryo'd and coated (gears) is also positive.

 

[Chuck Leeper]

I think that there have been some chain failures on engines w/ outrageous spring pressures.. As in near 400# on the seat.
I'd guess the choice is application dependent??

 

[turbodave231]

I'm using a Weber modified RollMaster chain. I am getting about 2 seasons on the chain before stretch becomes a concern. My spring pressures are 360# on the seat.

I've heard the Milodon gear drive is nearly bullet proof. I have a couple gear drives but never used them.

 

[Alky V6]

Milodon gear drive gets my vote. If setup properly, there is zero noise with this setup. No noise means no nasty harmonics.

 

[gnxtc2]

Here is Danny Bee's website: It doesn't show the Buick set up, only the cam retention plate.

http://www.alwaysopenmall.com/layou...romFamily=0&ProductFamilyID=0&RelatedItemID=0

I bought my belt set up from Mike Boeher. He also modified my distributor as a foward facing type. There is more work involved going to a belt drive set up. Need a remote oil pump and remote water pump. And the previously mentioned distributor.

Billy T.
gnxtc2@aol.com

 

[Nasty Wendy]

Milodon gear drive gets my vote. If setup properly, there is zero noise with this setup. No noise means no nasty harmonics.

That sounds like the ticket. I have NEVER heard of a completely quiet timing gear set up. Got any details or can you point me to someone who does?

Here is Danny Bee's website: It doesn't show the Buick set up, only the cam retention plate.

http://www.alwaysopenmall.com/layou...romFamily=0&ProductFamilyID=0&RelatedItemID=0

I bought my belt set up from Mike Boeher. He also modified my distributor as a foward facing type. There is more work involved going to a belt drive set up. Need a remote oil pump and remote water pump. And the previously mentioned distributor.

Billy T.
gnxtc2@aol.com

By remote oilpump do you mean something like a Duttweiler set up? I can deal with that. If you mean a dry sump type oil pump then thats a no can do.

 

[gnxtc2]

By remote oilpump do you mean something like a Duttweiler set up? I can deal with that. If you mean a dry sump type oil pump then thats a no can do.

No, the belt drive set up has no water pump or oil pump provisions. You will need a dry sump type set up, which is far better that the stock style set up even compared to the Duttweiler. It is very easy to do but sounds and looks complicated.

I see you are asking alot of Stage 2 questions which is good thing. If you going to start building a Stage 2 motor, you are in a different ball field. You can not cheap out or there will be major carnage.

Billy T.
gnxtc2@aol.com

 

[Nasty Wendy]

I have no intention on 'cheaping out' but I need this to look as much like a street engine as possible. A three stage weaver hanging off of the block kind of gives to much of a hint. The gear drive if it can be done quietly sounds like the ticket for me. Please keep the info coming as I am all ears. Major carnage would be a bad thing.

Info on making the gear drive quiet would be much appreciated.

Many thanks for the info thus far.

 

[Alky V6]

My Milodon setup is a perfect example of a quiet gear drive. I'll be at the WCN this weekend if anyone wants to try and hear the gear drive.

 

[BlownV6]

I have the Danny Bee belt drives and I sell the Milodon gear drive complete
set-up with instructions (used) $125.00 for the standard or $150.00 for the
HD unit. I personnally have used both types. I see no difference between them as far as usage goes, I never had the first problem with either!!!
Let me know if I can help!! Mike

 

[Nasty Wendy]

I have the Danny Bee belt drives and I sell the Milodon gear drive complete
set-up with instructions (used) $125.00 for the standard or $150.00 for the
HD unit. I personnally have used both types. I see no difference between them as far as usage goes, I never had the first problem with either!!!
Let me know if I can help!! Mike

I have your card right here on my desk. I'll be giving you a call.

 

[Jay Wicks]

If this is to be a street strip stage II, why not just run a stock type front cover and a quality chain???

 

[Nasty Wendy]

If this is to be a street strip stage II, why not just run a stock type front cover and a quality chain???

Why are you asking me the same question I'm asking everybody else?:smile:
I don't know whats best to run on them. I will be doing A LOT of street driving with it and I was ASSUMING that chains won't last nearly as long with the increased spring pressures/lift of a solid roller cam. Hey man educate me. I'd really appreciate it. Is there any reason NOT to use the gear drive?

 

[BLACK MAGIC RACING]

Mr. Nasty, I use a stock style front cover on my SII, over 300#'s on the seat, and i use a progear timing chain. If it's good enough for Dan Strezo, it's good enough for me!

BTW, u using that expensive oil pan i sold ya?

 

[Nasty Wendy]

Mr. Nasty, I use a stock style front cover on my SII, over 300#'s on the seat, and i use a progear timing chain. If it's good enough for Dan Strezo, it's good enough for me!

BTW, u using that expensive oil pan i sold ya?

That oil pan is trying to get used on a production 4.1 that will power my car until the Stage2 is ready. If my machinist EVER gets to work.

Back to the chain, do you street drive your car a lot? Do you know if Dan Strezo does? Longevity on the street is very important to me.

 

[Jay Wicks]

You can come out of the stock pan or deepened stock pan with a-12 line from something as simple as a "reused" pickup cutout from one of the Moroso dry sump pans that were on most of these motors, welded into the stock pan.
From there the supply line goes into the side of the block above the upper stock feed port to the cover. The hole is drilled then tapped, then intersects and radius to the front cover upper feed port. A quality cover properly machined and ported works well. Paint it all black and it's almost "invisible". You can expand from here to add in alum fabricated oil pans and XYZ external oil adapters to the front cover. A quality chain will last well on the street. The first stage that I did this way is still running around, over 14 years later.
The Danny Bee is a great setup, one of my favorites for a race car. You would need a little fab work for all the stock accessories.
Nothing wrong with a gear drive, may transmit more harmonics, may not. Some will tell you that you won't be able to get out of the driveway with a gear drive. I have had good luck with several of them, no issues. The single idler Milodon won't fit under the stock cover with out some cover modifications and some welding, but not a big deal. Lots of options.

 

[Nasty Wendy]

According to Milodon the gear drives last indefinately and are virtually indestructable. I like that. I'm gonna have to get out to hear them in action.

That part about lasting indefinately really appeals to me because I absolutely HATE removing the front cover. I ALWAYS end up dropping the pan to put a new oilpan gasket on whenever I remove my front cover. That POS little piece of gasket for the oil pan that comes with the timing cover gasket set always causes a nagging leak......ALWAYS.

OK so I need to (1) hear the Milodon gear drives in action.
(2) figure out the modification that will be needed to run one with a stock timing cover.


Again folks I thank you for the insight.