why not a bigger "Biggie" oil filter adapter?

[Silver 6]

See? Areas of agreement. I do not have the by-pass in the filter adapter blocked on my 87T. On the other hand, Lonnie Diers did the beta testing of the "Biggie" adapter kit and having the by-pass blocked in his motor saved him a lot of grief when the next flat tappet cam wiped. He went through three cams in short order before going to a roller.

Is there one answer? Not that I can see. We all just learn and make our choices.

I was also lucky to make friends with a guy who built Buick V6 test motors for the oil/fuel testing labs for over 15 years. I ended up with a storeroom of NOS parts and I learned a lot.

 

[The Radius Kid]

The way I see it,the PF2-24's are plenty big enough element-wise to suck up more than their share of garbage before before the efluent becomes a serious enough problem to cause a pressure loss and subsequent bypass opening.
I think our biggest demon to face is the crap cams that are being marketed these days [even the SBC and 5.0 guys are noting this,go figure],and the steps guys are being forced to take to avoid damage to their engines from these "timebombs".
That is sad.
All this garbage should not be necessary.
I've checked out the hardness of some old cams from the late seventies and early eighties,and they're much better than the ones they sell today.Chinese blanks done on the cheap?Could be.
BTW,does the PF24 cross reference to a Fram ph8?If so,a ph13a or a ph 20 [long,truck style] would cross.
I believe that the PF2[Ford 5.0-5.8 filter]has a built in anti-drainback because Ford found that the oil was siphoning out of the filter after shutdown even though the filter is vertically mounted.

 

[FJM568]

Well, I'm running the Purolator PureOne 20033 on my 85...I don't have the bypass blocked, but I wish I did....I just found the #3 exh lobe wiped on my cam and hopefully the filter caught it all and maybe none of it went through the bypass...I do know that I will be blocking the bypass now during the cam swap to hopefully catch some of the crap that may still be floating in the system...I had a tick that I hadn't figured out was the wiped lobe and changed the oil and filter, so all I have now is oil that was used for just idling and being circulated during the diagnosis...hopefully the PureOne filter picked up most of the particles in the oil and now with the cam swap, I will change the oil and filter again, do the cam break-in, and change the oil and filter once more after maybe a hundred or so miles, change the oil and filter yet again, put maybe 500-1000 miles with another oil and filter change, and hopefully by then will have most of the crap out of the engine...My oil pan does have another drain plug welded to it...bought a spare oil pan from the local U-Wrench-It where they just poked a hole in the pans to drain them instead of taking the drain plug out LOL...So all I did was weld a jamb nut to the bottom of the pan and installed another drain plug in the pan...There is nothing on the inside of the pan to block the flow of oil out through the hole so I can literally completely drain the pan out...I may just pull the whole pan and wipe it down on the inside as well...

Hopefully, my motor didn't suffer any other damage due to the cam lobe wiping...Only has 13000 miles on a fresh build...Now I'm wishing I did the bypass like I had originally planned...

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

***
Why doesn't someone make a 90* adapter that points the filter straight down? Or at least more parallel to the block then the stock set up. Sure would cure the drain back issue.

****
this is a good idea--->

or you could use the pte turbo saver instead??

 

[pwrhws]

As far as blocking off the bypass in the pump I would have to agree to the fact that it should not be done on a daily driver.

Without proper warmup you will develope problems with the cold thick oil.

I have collapsed just about every filter I had on my car. I switched to a biggie kit and I promptly killed thh purolator filter that it came with. Right now there is a wix filter on it with an internal bypass. That, so far, has seemed to alleviate the problem.

The delco filter would collapse the element then blow the seal. What a mess. When the purolator went there was absolutly no indication. Nothing externally or any differences in oit pressure. with an oil change due i visually inspected th Pure one and it showed that the element not only collapsed but ruptured. Thank god that one wasn't on there when the cam went south.

 

[FJM568]

Are you running a hi-vol pump???

 

[tom h]

Looking at my disassembled filter maonting base, it appears that the unfiltered oil from the pump first flows thru the oil cooler (in radiator tank) and THEN goes thru the filter.

is that right?

in case of shrapnel in the engine, the cooler gets contaminated.
too bad the cooler doesn't get filtered oil.

 

[tom h]

just a thought -- those of you who've had ruptured filters from too much cold oil pressure, maybe try the Mobil-1 filter ?

it's expensive (~$11 at autozone) but of very durable looking construction.

it's noticeably heavier in your hand, and the thicker shell doesn't deflect at all when you squeeze it. the filter element (from mfr's description and claims) seems comparable to Purolators PureONE series.

some guys that dissassembled it gave the Mobil-1 high marks at their web sites.

cross refs (Delco = PureOne = Mobil1) :

PF52 = PL24011 = M1-201 (stock-like, M18 x 1.5, no bypass?)

PF24 = PL20033 = M1-203 (Biggie, 13/16-16 , no bypass ?)

PF2 = PL30001 = M1-301 (Ford style, 3/4-16, has bypass?)

 

[pwrhws]

Yes it is a hi-volume frt cvr.

The problems I see are not with the outside of the case, It is the inside core that support the actual element itself. That is what is collapsing.

 

[JeffG]

pwrhws,
I had the same problem with the PureOne filter. It basically imploded on it's self, then puked the o-ring and spit oil all over the ground. I now run an AC-24 with 20/50 oil, oil pump blocked, without any problems. It's a daily driver (at least lately anyway)....knock on wood I have yet to have a problem with this filter. I have also ran the ACGold (more restictive) and not had an issue with those either.
I would keep an eye on the WIX. My motor had a lot of start up clatter with that filter. I yanked it off to find the drain back seal had pulled away from it's groove near the threaded area. It wasn't holding oil.
Maybe a remote set-up with a large capacity filter would be in order. I have been kicking around the idea of an Oberg. After reading this stuff (it's not the first time) makes me think I should do it sooner rather then later.................

 

[FJM568]

It's your hi-vol pump causing it to implode with the bypass blocked...Hate to say it, but you need to put the stock oil pump setup back on to run with the bypass blocked...

The hi-vol pumps have the same length gears as what is used on the Buick 455 standard oil pump...I blocked the bypass on the 455 pump cover and collapsed the filters just like you described...In talking with Lonnie Diers(he was into the BB Buicks bigtime) about this, he said you can't run a blocked bypass on the 455's...Basically, with the hi-vol pump on the 3.8L motor, you are pushing the same vol of oil that a big block Buick needs normally...

Put the standard cover back on with the blocked bypass, and I'd bet that you won't collapse another filter...As a matter of fact, I'm going to do just that when I do my cam change on my 85 GN, when I take my hi-vol cover off for the cam swap, a standard cover is going back on with a blocked bypass...I should have done that to begin with on that motor, now there is no telling how bad my bearings and stuff are because of the wiped lobe...with the blocked bypass, the filter would have caught most of the crap running through the motor...I just changed the oil in the car, now it will get drained out again with no miles on it, do the cam swap, block the bypass, break-in the new cam, change the oil again, put about 100 miles on it, change it again, run it about 1000, change again, and I should be good to go...I'm using the PureOne 20033 on the car...

This is just my experience with this...

 

[JeffG]

FJM568,
I run a stock cover. I do not run a high volume pump, and have still collapsed a filter. Honestly, the only brand I had collapsed was the PureOne. Go figure? I never see more then 60psi hot or cold.

 

[tom h]

it appears Baldwin DOES make a larger PF24 equivalent filter, allowing use of the simple RJC Biggie adpater.

The exact PF24 replacement from Baldwin is B39 (anti-drainback, no internal bypass, 95mm OD, 110mm length).

Baldwin catalog references a "long" version, B9. B9 is 134mm long, otherwise same specs.

That's a 22% longer shell, so the % increase on the filter media should be at least that much. That should help filter the same or more oil with lower pressure drop, decreasing the risk of bypassed, unfiltered oil.

of course, just because the filter is in the Baldwin catalog doesn't mean it's readily available ... I'm checking. The long B39 is said to be a match for the Delco PF31, and the PF31 appears to be no longer available.

 

[RDavis]

Wore a cam lobe out and did damage

I wore #3 cylinder intake cam lobe on a new camshaft. It scored mains rods. Had to send out crank to get hard chromed. So it will Take out an engine!! The only question is will the pressure drop from a non bypass fiter wipe it out as well
Thanks Rod

 

[FJM568]

ummm...filters that GM used don't have bypasses in them...

 

[feltonr]

I installed a double filter kit and use two PH8 filters works great
also have high volume pump.




87 GN 11.7 116mph 1/4 et.
91 ZR1 13.2 107mph
79 TA 13.1 108 mph