Wow! Good stuff. Probably mostly from the better hotside.
0 GAINS AT THE STRIP AFTER $1000 SPENT
- Thread starter ADJMART
- Start date
Wow! Good stuff. Probably mostly from the better hotside.
87turbot-type
wo2
- Joined
- Sep 2, 2007
Well there's a cork there for sure. All things being equal, you should see a gain by switching the heads even with the stock cam. Your exhaust seems like it should be good enough to go 120+. I'm thinking switching the inter-cooler would be the easiest to test out.
Just adding this
http://turbobuick.com/forums/threads/fastest-times-with-a-te44.313108/
Looks like most of the fast mph ones have a cam and inter-cooler upgrade. Otherwise similar setups to yours.
Just adding this
http://turbobuick.com/forums/threads/fastest-times-with-a-te44.313108/
Looks like most of the fast mph ones have a cam and inter-cooler upgrade. Otherwise similar setups to yours.
??? The hotside on a TE62 is a 76p ex wheel and has more potential than a 62 ex wheel. Probably from the increased pressure ratio and better cold side.
Your combo and mine are very similar, and I've gone 119 mph on 100-octane fuel with no alky. I see two major differences between our combos...
1. Intercooler - I've got a CAS V2 (i.e. a huge front mount), you're still running stock. Keep in mind that when you are running a TA49/TE44 at 25 psi of boost, the compressor efficiency is low. See Post #8 in this thread: http://turbobuick.com/forums/threads/yet-another-which-turbo-thread-120-mph-goal.372945/ At these boost levels, you should be moving more than 50 lb/min of air (because of your better heads), and your compressor efficiency is 65% or less (lower than mine, your points are farther to the right on the compressor map). I did the math. At 100% efficiency (the perfect compressor), 60-degree air, and 25 psi of boost, the temperature of the air exiting the compressor would be about 230 degrees Fahrenheit. However, because it's only running at 65% efficiency, the air temperature exiting the compressor will actually be about 325 degrees Fahrenheit or more. This comes from simplified thermodynamics calculations, maybe not perfect, but gives you the idea. So, your intercooler has to suck the heat out of over 50 lb/min of over 325-degree air. My CAS V2 has a much better chance of doing that than your stocker. As you turn up the boost above 25 psi, the compressor efficiency falls off very quickly, so the air coming out the compressor is even hotter, and your intercooler is being asked to do even more. Your intercooler can't keep up, so the air going to the intake is hotter than it needs to be. Net result - you turn up the boost, but you can't make more power. Two solutions - larger intercooler, or turbo that can run those boost/mass flow combinations more efficiently.
2. I seem to recall that at those power levels, my 57 lb/hr injectors were running around 80% duty cycle. That's about 46 lbs per hour. You are running 42 lb/hr injectors, so maybe they are maxed out? You are running alky, which adds more fuel, but it seems like you are right on the edge with those 42's... I'm worried that when you upgrade your intercooler and/or turbo, you are going to start leaning out because your injectors are maxed.
No more science tonight - too late. Good luck,
1. Intercooler - I've got a CAS V2 (i.e. a huge front mount), you're still running stock. Keep in mind that when you are running a TA49/TE44 at 25 psi of boost, the compressor efficiency is low. See Post #8 in this thread: http://turbobuick.com/forums/threads/yet-another-which-turbo-thread-120-mph-goal.372945/ At these boost levels, you should be moving more than 50 lb/min of air (because of your better heads), and your compressor efficiency is 65% or less (lower than mine, your points are farther to the right on the compressor map). I did the math. At 100% efficiency (the perfect compressor), 60-degree air, and 25 psi of boost, the temperature of the air exiting the compressor would be about 230 degrees Fahrenheit. However, because it's only running at 65% efficiency, the air temperature exiting the compressor will actually be about 325 degrees Fahrenheit or more. This comes from simplified thermodynamics calculations, maybe not perfect, but gives you the idea. So, your intercooler has to suck the heat out of over 50 lb/min of over 325-degree air. My CAS V2 has a much better chance of doing that than your stocker. As you turn up the boost above 25 psi, the compressor efficiency falls off very quickly, so the air coming out the compressor is even hotter, and your intercooler is being asked to do even more. Your intercooler can't keep up, so the air going to the intake is hotter than it needs to be. Net result - you turn up the boost, but you can't make more power. Two solutions - larger intercooler, or turbo that can run those boost/mass flow combinations more efficiently.
2. I seem to recall that at those power levels, my 57 lb/hr injectors were running around 80% duty cycle. That's about 46 lbs per hour. You are running 42 lb/hr injectors, so maybe they are maxed out? You are running alky, which adds more fuel, but it seems like you are right on the edge with those 42's... I'm worried that when you upgrade your intercooler and/or turbo, you are going to start leaning out because your injectors are maxed.
No more science tonight - too late. Good luck,
- Joined
- May 28, 2001
I think the stock I/C was tested, and found to be only 58% efficient. Also, keep in mind that after thousands of heat cycles, road induced vibration, etc, the fin to tube integrity comes questionable. This further erodes the efficiency %. Corrosion, dirty fin surfaces, all contribute to the demize.
As I mentioned: Back psi is?
As I mentioned: Back psi is?
I thought all the TE covers and wheels used the T31 exhaust wheel. My bad. In that case, the TE62 should have performed just as well as the 6262 or at least close all else being equal.
With what turbo though? The efficiency of a larger wheel helps with an inefficient IC.
we4Mateo said:
They could have been used with any Garrett wheel. Stock all the way to GTQ. The 62cea has way more potential than a 60-1 but the 62 turbine will choke flow before the 62cea runs out. I'd dont know were the 62 turbine chokes on a hard running purpose built but I'd guess around 70-72 lbs/min. The 62cea can hit 78lbs/min. Ive seen that much out of it myself. 2.8:1PR on a 9:1 stock stroke with xfi 218 int/ex and race ported GN1's. Beyond 2.8:1 it heated the hell out of the air and mass flow backward. I had it as high as 3.2:1. Wanted to crank 700whp but was thwarted with 697 being the most. If the engine was 9.2:1 it would have done it. 10.2:1 would have netted about 720whp. It was an alky tune though.
Thanks for the info.And your right, the power logger showed my injectors at a 90% duty cycle at the top of 3rd gear even with the alky.
Sweet6 said:
At 90% duty cycle, each of your injectors is delivering about 45 lbs/hr of fuel. That's more that the OP's 42 lb/hr can deliver.
42 lb/hr times 6 injectors equals 252 lb/hr, or 4.2 lb/min. With a relatively safe F/A ratio of 11:1, those injectors can therefore support about 46 lb/min of air flow when they are at 100% DC. 46 lb/min is about 460 HP at the crankshaft, which is about right for his trap speed (it all adds up). The added alky will change this a bit, but he's still on the ragged edge of what those injectors can provide. Putting a bigger intercooler or more efficient turbo on the car will increase the amount air the engine will swallow, and with the injectors maxed, he'll go lean.
Correct I was more so just giving an example of what I did with my set up to reference.
That's your problem. You only spent $1000. Spend another $1000 then you may see an improvement.
KS
haha,yeah
...im finding that outThat's your problem. You only spent $1000. Spend another $1000 then you may see an improvement.
KS
BoostedTtype
Member
- Joined
- Feb 18, 2008
