China Headers

[Just a Six??]

A turd is still a turd, no matter how you dress it up.

The stock headers are proven to work quite well into the 10s- why change them? Their weaknesses are well known, and it's an easy fix. Your offering/supporting a substandard product only bodes ill for you....

The true measure of whether is product is good or not does not come from you (obviously the manufacturer/rep)- the true measure comes from your customer feedback, as customer service really begins AFTER the sale is complete. The vendors that I purchase from provide a quality product, and back it up. Whether a vendor is making bank or not on the parts he sells is moot- it's business, pure and simple.

The only person you're trying to help is yourself, and your bottom line.

As far as your personal question....sounds like you're trying to sell me on Amway- same BS logic.

Again, a turd is still a turd, no matter how dressed up it is.

How can this guy be getting RICH at $250 a set? I dont understand??
I mean really, how can he be making more than about $75 a set???

 

[Mark E.]

You should have made a good quality prototype and had China make your product and then you could have a good quality item at an affordable price..... But no... you guys want it to be made in America..... QUOTE]


Terrible, Terrible person that Nick. Wanting to have it made here in America.

I bet Nick's do not need work to bolt on and rock. In fact I recomended a set for a friend's build. He saw the Chinese ones and I told him if he wants my help, the Chinese headers would not be acceptable.

 

[Nick Micale]

.........
Do you have the odacity to tell me you Designed the header from scratch and you are the only person who has ever thought of this design and your GODs gift to the designer. I don't think so! You add a bend on a header and its your perfect Design... I don't definately don't think so! If you would have played your cards smart.... Which I assume you didn't because your stuff is Expensive! You should have made a good quality prototype and had China make your product and then you could have a good quality item at an affordable price..... But no... you guys want it to be made in America..... There are a lot of products made overseas and they far exceed quality standards.... The standards are are set by the company and the maker of the products... You set quality control standards... if you don't care you get a crappy product! Don't be upset at me becuase you kick your self in the butt every night cause you didn't think of doing this first!

.....Thanks,

I did not want to debate this further, but your post is in need of "clarification".:smile:

In all the products from TA and myself one philosphy defines them - quality is a MANAGEMENT decision. We could not then, or now, demand and get the quality we demanded from China.

Also, the development period would have been many years, not just one year, as we evaluated and field tested every design and production change made in the development of these headers.

I doubt that China would use lasers and water jets in the production of the headers. We find it necessary to have this precision work done like this to obtain the quality and fit WE demand. The fine curves and fitment for the performance we wanted required we do it this way.

The production facility we use is one of the finest in this country [or anywhere], and has done quality and reliable work for many years. No way could we get this done in China to fit our requirements.

Unlike your, or whoever, goal was to copy the best and cheapest way possible, we DEMANDED a quality product and we did get one!

 

[turbo nasty]

I'll keep welding my ported stockers!

My last repair on the stockers has lasted 7 years of daily driving so the money that could be spent for foreign or domestic "Headers" will be enjoyed else where on the ride.

If the money is burning a hole in your pocket then try something different and get whoevers.

But, most of all, if you get whichever header post some before and after, boost in performance, this fits good this fits bad, etc. There is a heck of alot more folks that are in the performance range that DO NOT need the performance headers since the stockers are fine.

Quite honestly, I have not heard a ton of feedback from either vendors stuff from the end users that have installed them and their results. Either they could careless about "us" the Buick community knowing or they dont have a computer or both... lol.


TA Headers for me are outta my budget, but I trust TA and Nick that they are a great product...Period

Ebay/China/Bangladesh/whatever Headers...Man they are cheap and look appealing. But the fear of cracking,fitment issues, metalurgical quality,etc steer me from even trying them.

Who ever is defending the Ebay stuff get the folks who are over them to give/great price a set to a big vendor in the Buick community if the Ebay ones are great and then you have proof once they are on and work as advertised. When going up against ones that are proven all rweady out there something of the give to a vendor/promo set/ etc nature would be a good marketing thing.

My 02

 

[Mike Licht]

How can this guy be getting RICH at $250 a set? I dont understand??
I mean really, how can he be making more than about $75 a set???

If you get a price sheet from the company you will see it is much more than that. maybe double and then add back shipping. Poke around on ailbaba.com and get ready for some suprises
Mike

 

[SAMBALLS1]

Incorrect

I did not want to debate this further, but your post is in need of "clarification".:smile:

In all the products from TA and myself one philosphy defines them - quality is a MANAGEMENT decision. We could not then, or now, demand and get the quality we demanded from China.


Also, the development period would have been many years, not just one year, as we evaluated and field tested every design and production change made in the development of these headers.

I doubt that China would use lasers and water jets in the production of the headers. We find it necessary to have this precision work done like this to obtain the quality and fit WE demand. The fine curves and fitment for the performance we wanted required we do it this way.

The production facility we use is one of the finest in this country [or anywhere], and has done quality and reliable work for many years. No way could we get this done in China to fit our requirements.

Unlike your, or whoever, goal was to copy the best and cheapest way possible, we DEMANDED a quality product and we did get one!

That goes to show all just how much you know about business!!!!! Quality is Decided by the DESIGNER!!!!!! You can desgin the best product in the world and you choose how to have it replicated! You set the Standard So basically what your saying in china doesn't have the capacity to produce a good quality product! Do you honestly think they don't have the technology needed to make laser cuts...... Laser cut flanges is just a verbal SELLING TOOL.... Just like Refelctive Optic Lenses is a glorified bulb... So you use a laser to guide the cutting tools WOW IT CUTS A FLANGE.... YOUR NOT DOING HEART SURGERY!!!

Also when you "Designed" your headers.... Did you use stainless steel on all the parts of the header????? Probably Not.... Is every customer you have ever sold completely satisfied with your header? Definately Not! I'm sure you gotten calls and complaints on your $1045 headers!!!!


Oh..... Nick.... a little schooling on Economics... Do you know why China can produce them so cheap????????? Because they own most of the raw steel in the WORLD!!!!! Not because it's a cheap part!!!!

Goes to show how cultured you are about the world around you!!!
Thanks,

Sam

 

[SAMBALLS1]

Who ever is defending the Ebay stuff get the folks who are over them to give/great price a set to a big vendor in the Buick community if the Ebay ones are great and then you have proof once they are on and work as advertised. When going up against ones that are proven all rweady out there something of the give to a vendor/promo set/ etc nature would be a good marketing thing.

My 02

It's a work in progress!!!

 

[Just a Six??]

Great Idea! When your happy with the product let Nick have a set to look at & then make his Honest Opinion on them. If Bad so be it! If Good, then maybe something can be done betwwen the 2 to help the Buick Community!
Nothing wrong with that is there?

 

[SAMBALLS1]

Great Idea! When your happy with the product let Nick have a set to look at & then make his Honest Opinion on them. If Bad so be it! If Good, then maybe something can be done betwwen the 2 to help the Buick Community!
Nothing wrong with that is there?

Yes there is.... you might drop his price!!!!



Sam

 

[SAMBALLS1]

Nick

Nick,

MY apology in regards to the incorrect reading in regards Laser cutting... I thought you meant laser guided cutting!! My apolgies... But yes China does have the capacity to do it...

Are you really using Laser cutting to make these, I could understand water jets but lasers?????? this is not a moving part... Doesn't have to have the .0002 clearance and tolerances... just needs to flush mount to the head and seal..

Oh... if your headers are so brain and heart surgery percfect. - That is why you use laser and water jet right? and that is what the technology is for right? For PERFECTION right??. With all this technology being used.... Why do you still have to use a gasket to seal the header to head?????


Thanks again,

Sam

 

[gnfanatic]

I think it is truly sad that these parts made in China are being supported. they are now copying many parts in the auto business, from Edelbrock heads,intakes to flowmaster mufflers etc etc. this is a grave threat to our American companies, they cant compete with material cost and labor. First it was our textile, then the fabric and now this and many others. I saw on one of our advertisers page that they sell a girdle made in China and it is like $200 less then RJ. its sad, really , its killing our country slowly. Dont some of you guys care about our jobs? You think Nick and TA pay the ****ing welder 15 cents an hour to weld these headers? Whats going to happen to Edelbrock in the future?? Cunningham? Oliver? Eagle sell rods for 1/2 the price of these American companies. What next ? Chinese cars are coming next year. we are destroying our own country and help building a future Communist super power.

 

[SAMBALLS1]

I think it is truly sad that these parts made in China are being supported. they are now copying many parts in the auto business, from Edelbrock heads,intakes to flowmaster mufflers etc etc. this is a grave threat to our American companies, they cant compete with material cost and labor. First it was our textile, then the fabric and now this and many others. I saw on one of our advertisers page that they sell a girdle made in China and it is like $200 less then RJ. its sad, really , its killing our country slowly. Dont some of you guys care about our jobs? You think Nick and TA pay the ****ing welder 15 cents an hour to weld these headers? Whats going to happen to Edelbrock in the future?? Cunningham? Oliver? Eagle sell rods for 1/2 the price of these American companies. What next ? Chinese cars are coming next year. we are destroying our own country and help building a future Communist super power.

AND THEY ARE WORKING ON CONCRETE!!!

 

[broke1]

Lets be realistic,R&D on products like headers and DP's is MINIMAL.Not to mention theyre used on those who developed them's own cars.

Nick Micale,I understand your frustration,I really do but Buick vendors have been STICKING it to people for 20+ years.You guys have had a monopoly for years!!

With the influx in Chinese parts,its finally the customers time.This market is big enough for USA and China made parts.

 

[SAMBALLS1]

Lets be realistic,R&D on products like headers and DP's is MINIMAL.Not to mention theyre used on those who developed them's own cars.

Nick Micale,I understand your frustration,I really do but Buick vendors have been STICKING it to people for 20+ years.You guys have had a monopoly for years!!

With the influx in Chinese parts,its finally the customers time.This market is big enough for USA and China made parts.

AMEN, HALELUIAH, PRAISE JESUS!!!!

 

[JayC]

Lets be realistic,R&D on products like headers and DP's is MINIMAL.Not to mention theyre used on those who developed them's own cars.

You guys really have no clue.

Shane and I have been working on a new header design for 18 months and I can assure you it isnt cheap. One offs are very expensive and even looking at production runs of 50 sets, our COST was over $1400 a set.

Granted we could outsource the design to China but youre sort of screwed there. You send your $3000.00 prototypes over there, they make you a test set, send them back and if it looks and fits okay, you put for the full run. If what you get back isnt as nice as the test set, youre hosed.

NOT TO MENTION that they will not gaurentee you exclusivity of YOUR OWN DESIGN but for 6 months then they will sell them to anyone.

 

[JayC]

AMEN, HALELUIAH, PRAISE JESUS!!!!

Spoken by someone who's never developed **** for a car.

 

[SAMBALLS1]

What's **** mean... What have you developed recently! I haven't produced any thing personally, but let me assure you I have funded most of the inventions out there with my purchases! in the past 10 years I've made over 50K in purchases how much did you contribute!


For a moderator you've got so much hate.... Why don't you tell me how you really feel....... Let's see how professional a moderator/admnistrator really is!!!!!

 

[SouthernCal GN]

What's **** mean... What have you developed recently! I haven't produced any thing personally, but let me assure you I have funded most of the inventions out there with my purchases! in the past 10 years I've made over 50K in purchases how much did you contribute!


For a moderator you've got so much hate.... Why don't you tell me how you really feel....... Let's see how professional a moderator/admnistrator really is!!!!!

5 grand a year- really big numbers, eh?

There's so much more going on behind the scenes to bring a product to market than most realize.......and it's not cheap to do it right. Yet, everyone wants it for free.....

 

[pitch black]

AMEN, HALELUIAH, PRAISE JESUS!!!!

A couple of the dumbest people I have ever read anything from on the internet. Get a clue a come back later. If you can't afford to play with the big boys go home!

 

[Project TNX]

To me, it isn't about "Buy American", it's about not supporting thieves. I mean damn, couldn't you have at least changed a part or two? Plus, I choose function over form when it comes to performance, and the stock headers will perform all my goals just fine. I only upgraded my intercooler for the reliability factor that comes with lower knock, less boost, cooler air, and the unbelievable price gbodyparts offered me, not for any tenths of a second or what not.