New Best

[Razor]

.652
1.542
4.577
7.072
96.42
9.221
11.009
125.80

You's guys with those small turbos' getting them numbers..had to raise the bar tonite.

25 PSI peak boost, on ET Streets.

 

[tim87tr]

You can run that much boost on pump gas

Great time...so close to the 10! I'm right there with ya, but have to wait till spring Are the tracks in FL open all year? I only made it out 4 times this year and the tracks here close beginning of October.

What turbo you running now and is this on stock heads? You are putting down some serious mph, must have a Q-trim now?

 

[4sfed4]

Awesome Julio! When I saw you punch it and take off on the way to dyno yesterday AM (my dyno appt, not Julio's...he came to help tune the alky kit), I knew you were going to have some good runs at the track That car runs out hard!

 

[Razor]

Originally posted by tim87tr
You can run that much boost on pump gas

Great time...so close to the 10! I'm right there with ya, but have to wait till spring Are the tracks in FL open all year? I only made it out 4 times this year and the tracks here close beginning of October.

What turbo you running now and is this on stock heads? You are putting down some serious mph, must have a Q-trim now?

Tim, its a TE67 with a 69 trim wheel. This is through a 58 MM TB, and a GM MAF

Tracks here are open year round pretty much. They close for a couple weeks end of this month..then re-open in early Jan. Last nite was a cold nite here 63 degree's... so the weather contributed to the MPH increase.

I had the passenger window down on that run.. forgot to close it.. maybe had the window been up ..

Larry, its coming around.. bout time..need to keep this weather and get it out a couple more times..

 

[tim87tr]

Originally posted by Razor
Tim, its a TE67 with a 69 trim wheel. This is through a 58 MM TB, and a GM MAF

I had the passenger window down on that run.. forgot to close it.. maybe had the window been up

You'd have to have both windows down and the door propped open for the aerodynamics of the black boxes

Is the 67 a 66mm wheel?

 

[V6POWER]

Great time/mph. Are you running stock heads?

 

[Razor]

Jim, the heads are ported TTA heads. 125.8 on stock heads would be something.

 

[V6POWER]

How much timing?

 

[slim]

Razor, please empty your PM's so I can send you one. You also need to delete outgoing PM's or they take up your entire PM space(in case you didn't know that)
Thanks.

 

[Hyboost4Banger]

Julio, Your my hero!...........even if your car is not so stock as I thought it was..........and you run with your window down.....
Can you run more boost? say 26 or 27 psi?

I want a ten second car too!..

Mark

 

[Razor]

Mark.. stock is a relative thing. I try and keep as many stock parts as possible in my quest. I had run 32 PSI on the stock heads/cam.. And on this combination i'm still trying to sort it out. Over the last few months i've had a bunch of gremlins that keep surfacing.

If you look in the section for 4SFED4, he has a Dodge that dyno'd at 500 to the wheels at 30 PSI..he's now running 34 PSI on the street on methanol.

Look Quick, it was an TT chip 23-20 and I had bumped the timing two degrees.. so 25/20. I think that 25/22, two more PSI boost, and the same fuel curve.. 10.80's at 128-130 are possible. Will it do it on the OEM MAF??? or the 58 MM TB??? those are good questions.. I'll see. As soon as the 1/8 mile goes to 100-102.. be rite there.

 

[HellOnWheels]

Originally posted by Razor
Mark.. stock is a relative thing. I try and keep as many stock parts as possible in my quest. I had run 32 PSI on the stock heads/cam.. And on this combination i'm still trying to sort it out. Over the last few months i've had a bunch of gremlins that keep surfacing.

If you look in the section for 4SFED4, he has a Dodge that dyno'd at 500 to the wheels at 30 PSI..he's now running 34 PSI on the street on methanol.

Look Quick, it was an TT chip 23-20 and I had bumped the timing two degrees.. so 25/20. I think that 25/22, two more PSI boost, and the same fuel curve.. 10.80's at 128-130 are possible. Will it do it on the OEM MAF??? or the 58 MM TB??? those are good questions.. I'll see. As soon as the 1/8 mile goes to 100-102.. be rite there.

Julio,

What do you call "low" timing? If I made a run with a 25 degree factor even with alchy and 93, I'd put the damned heads in orbit! :>)

HOW

HOW

 

[Razor]

In first/second gear on a Buick.. no prob.. Keep the O2's in the 770-790 range minimum.. it will make power there and not ping.

You run 25 degree's and bring the O2's into the 740 or lower range.. bring the catchers mit for the parts.

Throw some fuel, lots of alky, and timing.. it will lite up

When I say lots.. I mean lots.. turn the Initial up to the 1-2 o'clock position. And watch your fueling. That pass for 125.8 on the top my O2's were in between 760-770.

On the dyno it picked up HP by adding fuel.. at Reynolds I kept low timing and the car MPH was rite on.. So for this track outing.. I bumped the bottom end timing.. results speak for themselves.

That was the secret I found to get MPH on alky

Dont tell anyone

 

[4sfed4]

Originally posted by Razor

Throw some fuel, lots of alky, and timing.. it will lite up

When I say lots.. I mean lots.. turn the Initial up to the 1-2 o'clock position.

Same deal on my car. I thought I was confused, but I looked over various dyno plots over the weekend and the car definitely makes power sooner if I massively overspray the alky down low via an artificially high initial setting (say 1 oclock instead of about 11 oclock). It is a very very drastic increase in power down low! I think what happens is the alky is burning in the exhaust manifold and gets that turbo boogying

 

[eddc87]

Julio, Congrats on your new best. That is unbelievable. Where will it end? 10.90's, 10.80's, 10.70's or out there in some other universe. You have opened the gates to the unknowned. Do we dare venture? By the way my motor has oil on the spark plug threads also. I have noticed this for about 7 years. Must not hurt anything.

 

[Hyboost4Banger]

Larry, very interested in what you found alky (anti-lag ) does to spool your turbo faster at a lower RPM......do tell......us 4 cyl. guys need it.....do you have dyno numbers to share?

I run a Forced Performance 3052 ball bearing on my 4G63 mitsubishi, w/3.5 in. downpipe, I get full boost @ 3800 stock... after wrapping my manifold, exhust housing and down pipe with blanket and stock heat shields it comes on @ 3600-3750...would like to get it down to 3500 or below.

Can you say turning up the initial lowered full boost onset rpm?
and if so how much?



Mark

 

[4sfed4]

Originally posted by Hyboost4Banger
Larry, very interested in what you found alky (anti-lag ) does to spool your turbo faster at a lower RPM......do tell......us 4 cyl. guys need it.....do you have dyno numbers to share?

Yes...Ive got some dyno numbers. I will sift through them and post the pertinent ones. I am waiting on the files from last weekend to be emailed to me as well. (I put them to a 3.5" disk before leaving, but the files somehow got corrupted.)

I did also make a datalog of boost response while rolling along on the street. I could clearly see more boost at an given rpm when there was alky spraying vs. when there wasnt. And...when I cranked the alky up to what seemed like way too much (borderline, and in some cases actual, rich misfiring), the boost came on even better!

I run a Forced Performance 3052 ball bearing on my 4G63 mitsubishi, w/3.5 in. downpipe, I get full boost @ 3800 stock... after wrapping my manifold, exhust housing and down pipe with blanket and stock heat shields it comes on @ 3600-3750...would like to get it down to 3500 or below.

What wheels are used in that turbo? (I am not familiar with FP's model nomenclature, but will guess it uses a GT30 turbine and a 52 mm inducer on the compressor?)

Can you say turning up the initial lowered full boost onset rpm?

Yes! On my car for sure.

and if so how much?

Be right back with that answer! Hopefully I have the files on my computer here at work!

 

[4sfed4]

OK...heres a good example of my comments above.

http://turbododge.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=11196

These two dyno runs were made a few months ago. On Run 11, I was way underfueled up top (check the A/F plot). Consequently, I got a huge amount of KR (6-8 degrees on all 4 cylinders) so the power dropped off the table. Its pretty clear in the plot where the KR started

Now...on Run 13 (run 12 was aborted), there was NOTHING changed from Run 11 with the exception of--

1) I turned the initial setting on the alky controller ALL THE WAY! So, I was getting the most initial alky spray possible.

2) I turned the gain setting ALL THE WAY!

With those two settings, I was basically maxing out the single alky nozzle.

You can clearly see the greater amount of alky (I use methanol) flowing earlier on Run 13 as the A/F plot goes richer sooner. And, the car stays richer up top as well. (It was still a little too lean for my tastes, even though there was no KR on Run 13, which is why I added the second alky nozzle.)

You can also see the rich misfiring due to alky overload in Run 13 around 53-58 mph in the plot.

But....you can also see the power SHOOT up much much faster once the car fought through the excessive alky spray. There is a 150+ whp gain at certain points before peak power!

This plot is no coincidence. When I went back to the dyno last weekend, I had the intial turned back down again so that there was alot less alky flowing earlier in the rpm band. Guess what happened? The curves looked just like the Run 11 curve again! Way more lag!

So....what do you think I am going to do to the initial setting now? Its going back up! I will adjust it back in just to the point of misfire, then back it off some.

 

[4sfed4]

Heres another one backing up the above dyno plot. This one is my favorite

http://turbododge.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=11197

These are 4 datalogs taken on my car while rolling along on the street. The red line is boost vs rpm with no alky and a base gasoline fuel pressure of 38 psi. The black line is boost vs rpm with no alky and a base gasoline fuel pressure of 50 psi. (See a pattern yet?)

Now...here is where things get cool

The light blue line is boost vs rpm with no alky and a base gasoline fuel pressure of 50 psi along with a small (0.018" jet) shot of nitrous.

The dark blue line is boost vs rpm with alky and a base gasoline fuel pressure of 50 psi. It spools the turbo as fast as the small shot of nitrous!

So...there is certainly something to be said for overfueling (specifically overfueling with alky) down low to get things going. Even with the wideband on the dyno pegged more than full rich, more alky = more power at a lower rpm.

My car is now an methanol hog. On Saturday between the dyno runs and some driving around on the street (about 100 miles), I went through about 2 quarts....or roughly $1.50

 

[Hyboost4Banger]

Larry,

yes my FP 3052 is a GT30 series BB cartridge with a 4 inch inlet, minus anti-flutter= about 3 inch. Turbo is supposed to be good for 525 hp of air, I figure I make 100 AWD whp less w/ DIY washer fluid. My engine is bone stock. How does this compare to your turbo? I can't seem to get in to view your graphs on Turbo Dodge forum.

Are you running 2 m-10's nozzels?

Mark