Police use stun gun on 6-year-old...

[no-nos]

Originally posted by TT/A1233
While I may not,
A:WOO here, while i MAY NOT? come on TT/A I can't believe you could actually shot a 6yr old, who at in a worst case scenario has a big piece of glass in his hand, I'm not saying that you would ( i'd like to hope you would'nt) but you did leave the question open.


I have female partners who are just over 100 lbs and about 5'1" tall. They may have a different impression about those requirements.

a female officer being attacked, i could see her hitting the kid with her batton, or taser but not her side arm


I'm not missing the poing. The point is you object to a kid being jolted by electricy and I have NO problem with that. ANY act of force could be lethal and that includes pepper spray or a physical altercation. What if he had asthma where pepper spray could have killed him? What if he had a bad heart and a struggle would have caused a heart attack? What if, what if, what if.... What if he had a rare bone disorder that when his arm was struck with a baton it would have shattered his bones? More "what ifs". Truth is statistics back up the fact a Taser is the least lethal and most affective way to subdue potentially dangerous subjects, especially the armed ones.

I agree with you there a taser does save lives and prevents cops from having to use deadly force, i' just having issues with it being done on a six year old, that the mother on t.v. has said her son has never hurt himself or anyone.

A kid being restrained from threatening harm to himself a 3rd time with a weapon, or a kid fleeing police from a lawful detention by being jolted with electricity is a HELLUVA lot more kind than tackeling them or hitting them with a baton or pepper spray.

They get a 5 second shock of a lifetime, 15 seconds of recovery and all is done.....WHIP-T-DOO. You make it sound it's like sitting in the electric chair . [/B]

A: you make it sound like 50,000 volts is nothing, so what now eveytime a kid misbehave's a police can go to the school and zap the kid ( and i know what your going to say, that's a what if again, but this could also be a precedent.)


and i'm living in the land of OZ?



.

Just kidding , i did'nt take it personal

 

[TurboJunky]

Originally posted by no-nos
A: you make it sound like 50,000 volts is nothing, so what now eveytime a kid misbehave's a police can go to the school and zap the kid

50,000 volts isn't that big of deal. Sure, it's uncomfortable but it's over in an instant. You ever grab a spark plug wire?

I make a clear and unambiguous distinction between "misbehaving" and a kid who; destroys property maliciously, takes that property and uses it as an edged weapon to cut himself twice, threaten to cut himelf again and threaten adults with that weapon.

Is that what you consider "misbehaving"??

Are you not going to answer my previously asked scenario without devating from the givens this time?

Here's a reminder for the 3rd time:

Ok, consider this. You're trained as a police officer to use the Taser when a violent subject isn't responding to your commands. This kid isn't responding to your commands.

You have a partner, the kid has cut himself 2x already with a shard of glass and is threatening to cut himself again if anyone approaches closer.

You have these weapons at your disposal:

- Hands
- Pepper Spray
- ASP/Baton
- Taser
- Firearm

What's your next move? Quickly....tell everyone what you do right now....

Please tell us how those officers did "wrong" by your standards and what you'd do better. If you were to wait this long the kid would have been asleep by now. Perhaps that's your tactic??

 

[no-nos]

Originally posted by TT/A1233
no-nos,

Would you thoughtfully respond to the scenario I outlined earlier? I believe it to be accurate given the news reports but in any case it's still a hypothetical, albiet a possible one.

The only reply you gave was you'd hit the edged weapon from his hand. My given was that you couldn't approach to do that because he had threatened to hurt himself a 3rd time if anyone came closer.

I'd really like to hear what your next move would be.....

well since i could'nt approach him, I would try talking to him, i'd first of all let him know that i'm here for him, and if he needed my help, that if anyone was bugging him or picking on him, i would help him out, i would find something we both have in common and build on that, i'd speak to him in a calm tone of voice and ask the other 2 officers to step away or back, that way the kid does'nt see so many police officers around him, i feel that would make him more nervous, i would sit there and listen to what he has to say and slowly try to gain his confidence, let him see i really want to help him. i would take my time, to me this kid is trying to reach someone for help, i would work with him and ask him if there's something i could do for him, talk to him in a way that he would feel comfortable with me use phrases like little buddy, partner and anything else i could think of and if in this process i'd ask him if he would like to go to the car and play with the siren and use the laoud speaker all kids like playing with lights and sounds and of corse if he would want something from me, i would of corse ask him if i do this for you buddy will you do something for me? would you put down the broken glass for me .

it's all a matter of getting that child to trust you and no it's not going to be easy but i believe it can be done. I hope this answers your question, I do know this was a hypothetical situation, but you see what i was trying to do here.

 

[cruzn57]

Chill, please!

Hey No-nos
mellow out a bit, I applaude your concern for the kid, but back off a bit, you are not gong to change the world, but I'm not saying you or I can't make a difference.
don't take it so personal, I am also an ex cop, and still to this day work with about 100 officers daily, I do take offense to your continued remarks about officers who are only to willing to shoot, tazer, beat up, abuse, or other wise violate someones rights, you con't know all the police officers in the US, so please don't speak for them.
No offense bud, ( after all, your a buick owner) but you will learn much ,much more by listening, than by telling everyone everything you know.
how about we all stop beating a dead horse to pieces, and get on to new issues?
Thanks
cruzn57

 

[no-nos]

Re: Chill, please!

Originally posted by cruzn57
Hey No-nos
mellow out a bit, I applaude your concern for the kid, but back off a bit, you are not gong to change the world, but I'm not saying you or I can't make a difference.
don't take it so personal, I am also an ex cop, and still to this day work with about 100 officers daily, I do take offense to your continued remarks about officers who are only to willing to shoot, tazer, beat up, abuse, or other wise violate someones rights, you con't know all the police officers in the US, so please don't speak for them.
No offense bud, ( after all, your a buick owner) but you will learn much ,much more by listening, than by telling everyone everything you know.
how about we all stop beating a dead horse to pieces, and get on to new issues?
Thanks
cruzn57

hay cruz maybe you can point out where i said that officers who are only willing to shoot ? beat-up? and violate someones rights?
i never said that or anything remotely like that, i got no problem dropping the issue, but to say that i offended you? did i call you out personaly? i have been going back and forth with TT/A which i know is a police officer .I have not attacked him nor have i offended him and if i have, he has not said anything to me, i believe he knows my views on this is not an attack on him nor his profession, which i know is unlike any other out there, I don't know all the police officers in the u.s. but then again i never said that you did and i never said "i speak for them?" but you did,
my views and my opinion are my own but i asure you i'm not the only one who feels this way, And you are right i'm not going change the world, but i can and have tried to make it a better place. This whole issue was about 1 incident only, i'm not hear defending criminals, or argueing if their rights were violated or not, I personoaly like seeing the cops beat the crap out of someone who just stole a car or rob someone.

I apologize for offending any one who is offended but these are just my views on 1 issue NOW can we get back to our buicks

 

[no-nos]

i'm done with this issue, i don't want anyone here to get the wrong idea and tt/a i enjoyed our little squable but i hope you know it was nothing personal on you( i think you know that) it was an issue which had alot of areas of debate. so i will as cruzn said mellow out ( it's been a while since i heard that one)
that being said i'm finaly painting my gn this weekend coming up

 

[bishir]

As a teacher, I must say I totally agree with this action. I've seen children in the same situation. I also saw the interview with the 6 year old this morning and even looked mentally distrubed.

As a parent, I can understand why some would think the officer overreacted, but I think the media is toying with your emotion and not telling the whole story. I heard this on the radio last Friday and they didn't mention the part about the kids trying to injure themselves or being drunk in the case of the girl skipping school until the very end.

As far as the comments about blacks and hispanics overall not paying attention, I would have to dissagree somewhat. In general it's parents in poverty that tend not to be involved with their children's education and life in general. That involves all races, but unfortunally more of a percentage tends to be blacks and hispanics.

 

[bishir]

As a teacher, I must say I totally agree with this action. I've seen children in the same situation. I also saw the interview with the 6 year old this morning and even looked mentally distrubed.

As a parent, I can understand why some would think the officer overreacted, but I think the media is toying with your emotion and not telling the whole story. I heard this on the radio last Friday and they didn't mention the part about the kids trying to injure themselves or being drunk in the case of the girl skipping school until the very end.

As far as the comments about blacks and hispanics overall not paying attention, I would have to dissagree somewhat. In general it's parents in poverty that tend not to be involved with their children's education and life in general. That involves all races, but unfortunally more of a percentage tends to be blacks and hispanics.

 

[TurboJunky]

Originally posted by no-nos
well since i could'nt approach him, I would try talking to him, i'd first of all let him know that i'm here for him, and if he needed my help, that if anyone was bugging him or picking on him, i would help him out, i would find something we both have in common and build on that, i'd speak to him in a calm tone of voice and ask the other 2 officers to step away or back, that way the kid does'nt see so many police officers around him, i feel that would make him more nervous, i would sit there and listen to what he has to say and slowly try to gain his confidence, let him see i really want to help him. i would take my time, to me this kid is trying to reach someone for help, i would work with him and ask him if there's something i could do for him, talk to him in a way that he would feel comfortable with me use phrases like little buddy, partner and anything else i could think of and if in this process i'd ask him if he would like to go to the car and play with the siren and use the laoud speaker all kids like playing with lights and sounds and of corse if he would want something from me, i would of corse ask him if i do this for you buddy will you do something for me? would you put down the broken glass for me .

it's all a matter of getting that child to trust you and no it's not going to be easy but i believe it can be done. I hope this answers your question, I do know this was a hypothetical situation, but you see what i was trying to do here.

Ok, well thought response but I'll rebut in this way.

According to news reports they already tried talking him out of his situation....no-go. What's your PLAN-B?

On a side note and I'm only speculating here but this kid has some deep rooted problems and the tactic of "little buddy" and "wanna go play with the police car's toys" is beyond him. If he knows about cutting people (he's a person) I'd say he's seen/heard a lot more than middle-America's average 6 yr old. Perhaps this is where you and I differ. Considering this kid's actions and the totality of the circumstance I'd start talking to him as a pre-teen or early adolescent. Those tactics are different.

Thanks for the reply...

 

[need boost]

My kid would never be in this situation because I raised him with discipline.Beleive me,he would not want to deal with me if I caught him doing something like this.He would BEG for that tazer!

Damn straight!!!!!!!!! I was raised when you still would get a switch or belt put on your butt if you did something stupid. My dad would have beat me to death over something like that!!!!!!!!! That is a lot of the problem today , the parents are afraid to put some heat on the seat! I am not talking beatings here for the whimps that might be reading or heath care workers, I am talking a good spanking to get across the point that this is right, and this is wrong! Also I don't wont to hear its a BLACK kid. SO WHAT I hear enought of that , I don't care if he was green! We have several close black friends as well as white and a spanish friend and his wife and they all have children that mind them! Sounds to me like his parents were NOT doing their job or he wouldn't have been in that mess to start with! I am not wanting to start up on that one but if anyone in america has a right to fuss its the indians that got screwed! Most in that spot need to read RAISE your kid yourself !!! If not then you have this kind of mess to look for. Also before I let him cut me, hell yeah I would shock him! I wouldn't want to as I am an electrican and know the dangers of that kind of voltage but in reality the risks are very low because its such a short burst and its mostly voltage and not amps. Amps are what kills you!! Voltage just shocks the piss out of you lol. Is this the perfect way, who knows, but it did end it before he could harm himself or anyone else and in reality all he got was the piss shocked out of him. Ok off the soapbox now lol Daniel

 

[gn85]

I love when people dig threads that should be fossils.

 

[bishir]

Yup, this thread is a fossil, but Tazers were in the news again the other day. Apparently, a 16 yo got tazered and the tazer killed the person. It happens sometimes, but now there are protests against the use of tazers. Everyone seems to forget the amount of lives Tazers have saved.

 

[2quiktocare]

Watching the themes of this thread I can see one thing that is needed in this country. The civilians in our society hire, train, and maintain law enforcement to deal with protecting us from those that will harm us either physically or financially. They have agreed to put their lives on the line everyday. Not that they are needed to everyday, but they have to be prepared for it every minute.

Everyone needs to go on a ride along with an officer at least once to see what they deal with everyday, so we don't have to. You can't take any incident out of context and expect to understand what the cops had to deal with at that time.

It boggles my mind when anything happens like this, the press blows it out of proportion and then those that don't invest time to find out the whole truth are quick to turn on the very people that are serving us every minute of every day.