If you had the option of using an 88 turbo or a 76 q trim on a stage II car used mostly at the strip and running a 4500 stall convertor what would be the deciding factor in choosing one over the other? If you have enough injector for either turbo would the 88 offer any advantages over the 76? Other then maximum HP potential that is.
Pt88 Or 76 Q Trim
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mytquick87
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Who sells the 76 GTS and does anyone have any pics of it and what the differences are between that and the Q trim? Is it more user friendly for the street?
Well it looks just like any other 4 bolt T76 basically. Usually comes in "Hi-flo" compressor cover form I'd say, so the compressor outlet is big. But the exh wheel is vastly improved and a better fit for the job compared to the q trim. The wheel has one less blade and is much wider, with a much larger discharge hole.
I have a pic up at
GTS76 pics
TurboTR
I have a pic up at
GTS76 pics
TurboTR
I agree that stall isnt always a good thing. But if you already have the high stall in the car would that make it more user friendly with the 88 turbo. By the way the 88 turbo is a P trim and the 76 i have is a Q trim. Since the 88 turbo has more overall power potential where does this extra power come into use? If you run 20lb boost or 26 lbs boost will the 88 P trim and 76 Q trim make the same power at the same boost levels ? Does the 88 turbo allow you to run a higher boost to use the extra HP potential? I am trying to understand the relationship between the bigger turbo and the bigger HP it offers. The state of tune being equal of course
You won't even make close to the power the 88 will make with the 76. That turbo went 150+ on Chris Lyons car last fall at around 26 psi and would have got in the 8's if he did not have a coil pack issue.
I am not aware of the 76 Q getting close to the 8's and that MPH.
I am not aware of the 76 Q getting close to the 8's and that MPH.
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just asking...
Originally posted by Ted A.
You won't even make close to the power the 88 will make with the 76. That turbo went 150+ on Chris Lyons car.......... /QUOTE]
Ted, did Chris use a 3 bolt 88?
Am just interested in the answer to the original question and "assume" he [and I] want to know the results of a 3 bolt 76GTQ vs. a 3 bolt 88.
Joe Lubrant
" The Right Stuff "
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The only documented results or experience with the PT 88 3-bolt I have seen.
In 2000 TSE Trim my car at 3680-3700# ran 9.13@153.55mph.
That was with a 1.42 60', not considering the soft 60' the potential of an 8 sec pass was there.
The HP to the wheels based on mph was in the 1030-1040 range.
Jim Byrne's Silver T at 3250# in 2002? at Reynolds with a PT 88 3-bolt ran an 8.64 at 165+mph with traction issues. Easily above the 1050 rear wheel hp. Probably 1100+rwhp
Both cars with GN-1's were run at 30+# of boost. The PT 88 3-bolt has been rated for approx. 1200hp fly wheel, and has proven itself to meet or exceed that rating.
Considering the drive line losses of TH400 & Ford 9" rears in both cars, the PT 88 3-bolt performed admirably.
As far as the PT 76 GTQ 3-bolt vs the PT 88 3-bolt, I would believe that the difference would be an easy 125-150rwhp in favor of the PT88 3-bolt.
In 2000 TSE Trim my car at 3680-3700# ran 9.13@153.55mph.
That was with a 1.42 60', not considering the soft 60' the potential of an 8 sec pass was there.
The HP to the wheels based on mph was in the 1030-1040 range.
Jim Byrne's Silver T at 3250# in 2002? at Reynolds with a PT 88 3-bolt ran an 8.64 at 165+mph with traction issues. Easily above the 1050 rear wheel hp. Probably 1100+rwhp
Both cars with GN-1's were run at 30+# of boost. The PT 88 3-bolt has been rated for approx. 1200hp fly wheel, and has proven itself to meet or exceed that rating.
Considering the drive line losses of TH400 & Ford 9" rears in both cars, the PT 88 3-bolt performed admirably.
As far as the PT 76 GTQ 3-bolt vs the PT 88 3-bolt, I would believe that the difference would be an easy 125-150rwhp in favor of the PT88 3-bolt.
Re: just asking...
Originally posted by Nick Micale
Originally posted by Ted A.
You won't even make close to the power the 88 will make with the 76. That turbo went 150+ on Chris Lyons car.......... /QUOTE]
Ted, did Chris use a 3 bolt 88?
Am just interested in the answer to the original question and "assume" he [and I] want to know the results of a 3 bolt 76GTQ vs. a 3 bolt 88.
The topic was a "Q" trim 76 vs. 3 bolt 88. I would also be interested in the comparisons of a GTQ and better yet a "S" trim 76 vs the 3 bolt 88
Yes, Chris ran the 3 bolt 88.
Joe Lubrant
" The Right Stuff "
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Re: Re: just asking...
Ted,
The PT 76 "S" is not available in a 3-bolt configuration as the turbine wheel cannot be fitted into the housing due to size.
The GTQ 76 is the max for a 3-bolt set-up.
I personally feel that most people have forgotten the power that the PT 88 3-bolt has exhibitied in the past. (9.13@153.55-3680-3700# & 8.64@165+3250#)
Referencing my previous post about my car in 2000 GSCA TSE trim and Jim Bryne's cars performance at Reynolds a few years back shows that the PT 88 3-bolt is still a force to be dealt with.
Back then the GSCA dealt with the issue by making the PT88- 3 bolt ILLEGAL for the class the following year!
Heck back then by rule I was lmited to a 3" Down-pipe which of course hindered its maxmum capablities, but still exhibited its potential.
I am still not sure of the HP diference between the PT88 3 or 4 Bolt, but believe the difference is less than 50hp if that. The major difference is the 3-bolt is an on-center while the 4-bolt is tangential. Both of course sport a custom. PTE .96 a/r turbine housing.
If comparing a 76GTS 4-bolt to a PT88 3-bolt I would still bet my pay check on the 88 being the winner of the hp duel. The T4 4-bolt .96 a/r of the 76GTS is not as large as the custom 3-bolt .96 a/r used on the 88 3-bolt. Which will still exhibit better flow, with less back pressure. I am also sure that an 88mm compressor wheel will outflow a 76mm in an appropriate cover & turbine configuration.
The current ratings published for the PT 76GTS T4 style 4-bolt is 1100+fwhp
The rating for the PT88-3bolt is 1200fwhp, but documented performances have seemed to exceed this rating.
Not trying to discourage either choice, but for those who currently have after market 3-bolt headers on a GN-1 type Stage II engine, the PT88 3bolt is as good as it gets for max. power.
PTE invested alot of R&D and finances to develop the PT88 3-bolt for the T/R, only to have it outlawed in TSE. I am not sure if it was the GSCA alone or pressure from other Manufactures/Vendors who did not step up to the plate, and provide a comparable alternative.
BTW PT88 3-bolt turbo's are still available.
Ted,
The PT 76 "S" is not available in a 3-bolt configuration as the turbine wheel cannot be fitted into the housing due to size.
The GTQ 76 is the max for a 3-bolt set-up.
I personally feel that most people have forgotten the power that the PT 88 3-bolt has exhibitied in the past. (9.13@153.55-3680-3700# & 8.64@165+3250#)
Referencing my previous post about my car in 2000 GSCA TSE trim and Jim Bryne's cars performance at Reynolds a few years back shows that the PT 88 3-bolt is still a force to be dealt with.
Back then the GSCA dealt with the issue by making the PT88- 3 bolt ILLEGAL for the class the following year!
Heck back then by rule I was lmited to a 3" Down-pipe which of course hindered its maxmum capablities, but still exhibited its potential.
I am still not sure of the HP diference between the PT88 3 or 4 Bolt, but believe the difference is less than 50hp if that. The major difference is the 3-bolt is an on-center while the 4-bolt is tangential. Both of course sport a custom. PTE .96 a/r turbine housing.
If comparing a 76GTS 4-bolt to a PT88 3-bolt I would still bet my pay check on the 88 being the winner of the hp duel. The T4 4-bolt .96 a/r of the 76GTS is not as large as the custom 3-bolt .96 a/r used on the 88 3-bolt. Which will still exhibit better flow, with less back pressure. I am also sure that an 88mm compressor wheel will outflow a 76mm in an appropriate cover & turbine configuration.
The current ratings published for the PT 76GTS T4 style 4-bolt is 1100+fwhp
The rating for the PT88-3bolt is 1200fwhp, but documented performances have seemed to exceed this rating.
Not trying to discourage either choice, but for those who currently have after market 3-bolt headers on a GN-1 type Stage II engine, the PT88 3bolt is as good as it gets for max. power.
PTE invested alot of R&D and finances to develop the PT88 3-bolt for the T/R, only to have it outlawed in TSE. I am not sure if it was the GSCA alone or pressure from other Manufactures/Vendors who did not step up to the plate, and provide a comparable alternative.
BTW PT88 3-bolt turbo's are still available.
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Re: just asking...
[/B]/QUOTE]
Ted, did Chris use a 3 bolt 88?
Am just interested in the answer to the original question and "assume" he [and I] want to know the results of a 3 bolt 76GTQ vs. a 3 bolt 88. [/B][/QUOTE]
Yes I went 153 with a 3-bolt 88 a bad coil pack and a marginal tune.
[/B]/QUOTE]
Ted, did Chris use a 3 bolt 88?
Am just interested in the answer to the original question and "assume" he [and I] want to know the results of a 3 bolt 76GTQ vs. a 3 bolt 88.
[/B][/QUOTE] Yes I went 153 with a 3-bolt 88 a bad coil pack and a marginal tune.
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Re: Re: Re: just asking...
I'm definitely sold!!
I have my motor on a dyno as we speak. While I don't want to spill all the beans (and we aren't done testing) it is not even remotely difficult to make over 1000 HP with the 88. I did switch from the 3-bolt to the 4-bolt and went from a 3.5" DP to a 4" and feel the gains were minimal at best. Maybe 40-50 HP, maybe. Now a 16 volt battery is another story... I'm hoping to do a write up for the BPG newsletter.
From what I gather with the 3 or 4 bolt housing 88 you still need to modify the headers for clearence. Not a big deal but the flange needs moved down and over to clear the inlet pipe and TB.
I can't comment on what a 76 can or can't do but I can say this, I can make over 800 HP with 20 psi and 22* timing. I would think this difficult with the 76
I'm definitely sold!!
I have my motor on a dyno as we speak. While I don't want to spill all the beans (and we aren't done testing) it is not even remotely difficult to make over 1000 HP with the 88. I did switch from the 3-bolt to the 4-bolt and went from a 3.5" DP to a 4" and feel the gains were minimal at best. Maybe 40-50 HP, maybe. Now a 16 volt battery is another story... I'm hoping to do a write up for the BPG newsletter.
From what I gather with the 3 or 4 bolt housing 88 you still need to modify the headers for clearence. Not a big deal but the flange needs moved down and over to clear the inlet pipe and TB.
I can't comment on what a 76 can or can't do but I can say this, I can make over 800 HP with 20 psi and 22* timing. I would think this difficult with the 76
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