whats wrong with 50lb injectors?

I threw my reds chips in a box and threw them in the trunk. First of all he wouldn't put the fast update code in. That really pissed me off. Then both the race chip and street chip were pig rich, so I didn't even bother sending them back. I just bought the ME. Best choice I have made for this car in terms of tuning. You couldn't ask for a more helpful guy than Steve Y.

BTW, anybody want a 100 chip and a 106 chip?
 
Generally, Red's not such a bad place to do business.

BUT, like most people will find out, and as you've heard in this thread, It's "Red's way or the highway". Right, wrong or indiferent, that's the way it is.

Unfortunately, it's that type of attitude that drove me in different directions years ago. There's just TOO MANY GREAT vendors available for anyone to be so smug.

BTW, MSD 50's are FAR superior to the 009's. From someone who's been playing with chips for a few years, and others will probably agree, it took a long time to get the chips "dressed" to make the 009's streetable, with GOOD manners. Many still haven't figured it out.
I personally think the 009's are a waste of time and money, but then, who am I?? ;)
They just aren't worth the agrivation.
 
Originally posted by Steve Y
I am not sure if Red applies his voltage to the injectors or not. I was under the impression he applied it to the fuel pumps.

I set my voltage at 15 in both my cars so as to get 14.4 or so at wot.

I have been waiting for something to fail for 2 years and so far it has been just 1 battery......which was failing anywho.

I keep the batterys fully charged as a rule, but I suspect it would be rather hard on a low battery to get hit with 15v.

From what I understand, if it is NOT a deep cycle battery with heavier plates, the plates may have a tendency to warp a little with heat generated from a hard charge......where the o'l dead cell thing comes into play.

Steve
Click to expand...

I think you are right about red's booster, I think it goes directly to the hot wire for the FP, and it goes by Boost does it not? Or is it TPS?

The setup that Steve Y is talking about basically turns your alternator into a 1-wire, it's got a pot to set the disired voltage, which is then applied to the whole system. The nicest part about it is that it speeds up the power windows too. :D

Steve Y, Didn't you replace that Delco POS battery with another Delco boat anchor? ;) tisk, tisk.

Who runs 70psi static anyhow? Or better yet, has ANYONE actually experienced a failure with MSD 50s?
 
PRSRIZD are you suggesting that my $35 650 CCA rebuilt Delcos from Battery Heaven are not any good ???
 
No wonder you need 15 volts from the alternator it is doing all the work. ;)

Now go back to the other thread and 'splain the offset to me. :D
 
It's not what's wrong with them, but are they the best answer.

Look at any high speed pic of a rather large injector turning on, and for the first couple .1msecs, they are just dribbling. Then they develope a standard looking stream, and again at turn off they dribble. With the large orfice, and increased effort to turn on and off, it's just a fact.

Now, there is a way to get the injector to turn off and on faster. Drop the resistance of the windings, and you can pass more current and establish the magnetic field fast, and that opens the injector. If you using the right injector driver, it's a Peak and hold, so once the injector is open it cuts back on how much current there is to maintain the injector in the open posistion. With less holding current that means the injector can turn off quicker.

We're not talking about alot of time here, and with the injector shooting a closed valve anyway, it's not a critical deal.

BUT, if you're looking for the best injector control at slow speeds the peak and holds do have an advantage.

If you looking to get clever, with injector control then you'll want to go with the peak and holds anyway.

One other point is the 50s are the limit for that design, at 55 they gave up with it, hmmm wonder why?.
 
I wonder if Red stopped offering the Scanmaster quick update feature with his chips at some point in time, I had several chips made up for my Scanmaster around three years ago from him. :confused:
 
Originally posted by KENNE-BILL
I wonder if Red stopped offering the Scanmaster quick update feature with his chips at some point in time, I had several chips made up for my Scanmaster around three years ago from him. :confused:
Click to expand...

Most likely depends on who it's for and the mood at the time...
 
Has anybody asked Red if he likes Broccoli more then Spinach:) I love my MSD 50's I think they have better street manners over the 36lb Bluetops I ran for 8 years
 
I have to throw in a word here. I had blue tops but I was at their limit. Loved the injectors and most of the chips I had burned for them. I too had one of those pig rich chips that I "thought" and posted once ran faster. That was because my FP gauge was wrong and reading high. Because of the pig richness of the chip it was actually running at the correct mixture that I really wanted. Once I realized the problem and moved up the FP a little all the other chips ran faster than the pig chip and the pig chip slowed down unless I leaned out the FP. All in all I was able to get my Thrasher and Jay Carter chips to run faster. Like many, my pigs sit in a box but unlike the other "extra chips" the pigs are NOT in my car, they are somewhere lost in my garage.

I replaced my beloved blues with 50# injectors and love them! I got a Jim Testa chip and they idle and drive fine. It's like any injector, if you get the correct chip for the injector they run great. Jim was running 50's on his own car for years so he had lots of personal experience. Same for most of the other chip vendors that sell chips for 50's. They have the experience so can make the injectors run great. With all the great turbo?s out there making efficient charges with little to no lag, why tie yourself down with 009?s?

Hope this helps!
 
There is room for both. This hobby needs all the mavericks it can find to do their own thing. Otherwise we will be sitting here doing the same thing over and over again watching our vendors continue to clone each other and slowly going broke.

Red and Jane are nice people and, I am happy to see them take a different path. More than once in my career I told customers that I would not do what they wanted, and I have no problem with Red doing it his way. I can decide where to go if I don't want what he sells.
 
Originally posted by ULYCYC
Has anybody asked Red if he likes Broccoli more then Spinach:) I love my MSD 50's I think they have better street manners over the 36lb Bluetops I ran for 8 years
Click to expand...

I couldn't have said it better!
 
Originally posted by Mr URL

Red doesn't like Scanmasters or any scan tool less than DirectScan either or Translator setups. He won't put Scanmaster fast update code in his chips. As we all know it's Reds way or the highway. They other stuff works great but Red tends to be bull headed when it's not his product. He still can't convince me that volt boosters are the hot ticket. Did nothing for me but piss off my laptop. That lasted about 2 minutes. Most people are either a Red follower or not one. Red obviously knows his stuff but so do other people with their products.
Click to expand...



Very, very well said!


Donnie
 
When do the bluetops reach their limit?

I have a set of bluetops (not installed yet) and I am planning on a TE-44. I was thinking of trying to sell the blues in order to get the 50's, but I'm not sure that I need them. Will I be able to run high 11's, low 12's with blues?

Also, Is there much differece between the delphi 50s and the MSD 50's?
 
If your goal is low 12's, high 11's you can do it with blues. Also depends on what turbo you have. With a TA-49 I could run 25 psi of boost but when I upgraded my turbo to a PTA-52, I ran out of injector at 18 psi. I don't have the data in front of me but seemed I never had issues with the TA-49 but when I put on the PTA-52 I would be running a duty cycle of 134% at 18 psi and would get knock over 5200 RPM.


Hope this helps,
 
Originally posted by TurboDiverArt
If your goal is low 12's, high 11's you can do it with blues. Also depends on what turbo you have. With a TA-49 I could run 25 psi of boost but when I upgraded my turbo to a PTA-52, I ran out of injector at 18 psi. I don't have the data in front of me but seemed I never had issues with the TA-49 but when I put on the PTA-52 I would be running a duty cycle of 134% at 18 psi and would get knock over 5200 RPM.
Click to expand...


Goes without saying Art!!! Boost pressure actually has little to do with the "amount"/volume of air that you're putting into the engine.

That 52 can and does move a LOT more air than the little 49, and it can do it at a lot less boost.
 
Dave,

You're telling me! 12.2's at 18 psi of boost, 1.88 short times on no boost launch (2500 rpm), street chip and pump gas. Trans was going and short shifting at 5100-5200 rpm's. Had to even allow it to shift into OD at 5200 and BOG down big time to about 4200. Was cruising through the traps at 4500 RPM's and 111 MPH. I was pretty happy to say the least! Now just need to get back to the track with the alcohol hooked up, alcohol chip and 25 psi of boost off 10 psi launches. Ooohhh Doggie!

:cool:
 
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