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Your thoughts on the New 707hp 2015 Dodge Challenger Hellcat

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1. What you run on the track is absolutely worthless because you'll never be able to replicate that on the street. 2. A good track number comes from a combination of a lot of things being in alignment-tire choice, tire pressure, ambient air, driver skill, track prep, shift points/skill etc. MOST of the time all of those attributes are never in alignment at the same time. So sure, the car itself may be a low ten capable machine, but just like 99.9% of Corvette and Porsche drivers who lack a TON of skill, they're usually a high 12 second car on the street, with the typical driver on pump gas, with everyday tires. Just like comparing dyno racers to track racers, I believe it's the same comparison to track racers vs street racers. Most cars that run big numbers on the track can ONLY run those numbers on a track, which is like running them in a place that mind as well not exist. Most people don't live by a track, have the time to go to a track, or the money to blow. I believe the street is the TRUE proving ground. There's also a certain level of pressure you must learn to overcome while racing on the street. The people, the intimidation factor, etc. etc. It's like playing poker. You have to be cool as a cucumber, and not let the others get into your head. A track with a lot of track prep hides MANY car's shortcomings. Yea, all that shit goes out the window on the real streets.
To me, this 800 some hp is a waste on the street, because it will NEVER, EVER hook. But of course, with Chrysler's HORRIBLE torque management and throttle response, that hp will take about an hour to come on, so it MAY have some traction lol. But by then, a car that's set up for the street race will have already eaten it's lunch.
At any rate, I love the Challenger, I think it's a fantastic looking car, and love the current hp race our big three are in. Even though I'd never own another post '74 Chrysler product again, I still love it, and think it's super sexy.
 
Is this guy local to Phoenix? I think I saw him at Cruise on Central.

Yes, he's local and a good friend.

I was in California for Mike's Swap meet but I'm sure Ryan wasn't there. The car may have been there, though.
 
Horrible throttle response? They have to put that in the tune for the idiots...you can boost the drive-by-wire throtte response and remove most of the torque management. And yes, the HC will over power the street with most drivers...but thats true with any performance car. Personally, if I had one, I'd run the "black key fob" on the street...it's a tame 500hp...and leave the "red key fob" to the track with slicks (it can even go down to 300HP).

Here in the next few weeks when ppl start getting these out on the streets we'll know the truth and not just speculation. Just cuz these cars are heavy ppl think they aren't gonna be fast...my 392 is plenty fast and on the street i haven't had much trouble out of other cars...my old GN is the only car I've ran that stayed next to me on a 50 mph freeway run. From a dig the F1 tires are useless...but ppl serious about performance replace those with something better.
 
Horrible throttle response? They have to put that in the tune for the idiots...you can boost the drive-by-wire throtte response and remove most of the torque management. And yes, the HC will over power the street with most drivers...but thats true with any performance car. Personally, if I had one, I'd run the "black key fob" on the street...it's a tame 500hp...and leave the "red key fob" to the track with slicks (it can even go down to 300HP).

Here in the next few weeks when ppl start getting these out on the streets we'll know the truth and not just speculation. Just cuz these cars are heavy ppl think they aren't gonna be fast...my 392 is plenty fast and on the street i haven't had much trouble out of other cars...my old GN is the only car I've ran that stayed next to me on a 50 mph freeway run. From a dig the F1 tires are useless...but ppl serious about performance replace those with something better.

You can remove the torque management if you can break into the pcm. My 2013 200 pcm was just now cracked about 10 months ago. Who knows what that pcm has. If it's locked, you aren't removing anything. And I can tell you Diablosport hasn't really removed any of my throttle response issues, even maxed out at +20%. I can still floor the car and change stations on the radio before the transmission even gets the signal to start downshifting. And then when it begins, it takes it's sweet old time too. If the new Challenger has that same issue, it'll get it's butt WHOOPED by a car with slicks and a real throttle cable.
 
Hmmm..that's interesting...my '12 SRT has some also but not that much...I want the B&G ECU, it removes all the torque management and all the timing retard during shifts.

I'm installing a 6.1 in my '70 Satellite and I could have gone with a drive by wire setup but decided to go with the cable...the hemi's are awesome motors its the computers that kill em.
 
Yea, computers suck. The old one's like ours aren't that bad, because you can still easily manipulate them to do what you want them to do. Todays computers do all sorts of bullshit that you don't want them to do, and it can be frustrating. Like in my car. The transmission-it shifts all kinds a f****d up, it has two personalities, when you floor it sometimes it shifts down to 2nd, sometimes first, etc etc. it's all jacked up. I miss my 98 GS. When you hit the gas, that car shifted and went-now. I mean now. This car? Ugh... I hate computers.
 
There really isn't much out there for Chrysler for tuning, is there? GM is the way to go from a modern ECU perspective. There is a TON you can do yourself (or get a good tuner to do for you) with HP Tuners. I can't wait until HP Tuners starts supporting the Ecoboost and Coyote platforms. When that happens, watch out for Ford. I agree that the Hemi platform has a lot of meat left on the bone if someone can fully tune them.
 
Just gotta seperate the hemi from the factory computer...my 6.1 is using FAST XFI and I can adjust anything. I'd love to find a Hellcat engine and trans and transplant it into my b-body that only weighes about 3600lbs which is about 700 lbs lighter than the new challenger. lol
 
Yea, computers suck. The old one's like ours aren't that bad, because you can still easily manipulate them to do what you want them to do. Todays computers do all sorts of bullshit that you don't want them to do, and it can be frustrating. Like in my car. The transmission-it shifts all kinds a f****d up, it has two personalities, when you floor it sometimes it shifts down to 2nd, sometimes first, etc etc. it's all jacked up. I miss my 98 GS. When you hit the gas, that car shifted and went-now. I mean now. This car? Ugh... I hate computers.

Too many gears these days. 4 works well, 6 is enough, and more than that requires a genius tune to manage the skip shifts etc. No one has it perfect yet, that's for sure. For a smart person though, the modern ecm's do allow more performance with better safety than ever before. Even Ferrari's can be tuned, just takes more work and computer know how. Heck, China can hack banks, we ought to be able to figure out a Chrysler ecm.
 
Too many gears these days. 4 works well, 6 is enough, and more than that requires a genius tune to manage the skip shifts etc. No one has it perfect yet, that's for sure. For a smart person though, the modern ecm's do allow more performance with better safety than ever before. Even Ferrari's can be tuned, just takes more work and computer know how. Heck, China can hack banks, we ought to be able to figure out a Chrysler ecm.

No. We DID have it perfected. And then we just HAD to have 5 more gears. And we just HAD to have torque management. I got along just fine without it. And then we just HAD to have freakin cooled cup holders, and all other sorts of unnecessary bullshit. Rear view mirrors that talk to you, and windshield wipers on our freakin headlights. When it works, they find a way to dick it back up all over again. We just gotta keep playin' with shit. Then, after freakin we the end user gets unnecessarily used as their r&d mules, and they FINALLY get it all sorted out after 20 million of our dollars gets wasted, then they go and change shit all over again. Once you get it all nice and smoothed out, leave it alone lol. If they would have done with what the Aussies did and make the GS with the 3800 RWD, I'd still be in one today. Even though some of the older transmissions weren't that strong, they were still WAYYYY better than this load of garbage. Look up the transmission in my 200 and see what comes up... Engineers and the EPA. Gotta love 'em.
 
No. We DID have it perfected. And then we just HAD to have 5 more gears. And we just HAD to have torque management. I got along just fine without it. And then we just HAD to have freakin cooled cup holders, and all other sorts of unnecessary bullshit. Rear view mirrors that talk to you, and windshield wipers on our freakin headlights. When it works, they find a way to dick it back up all over again. We just gotta keep playin' with shit. Then, after freakin we the end user gets unnecessarily used as their r&d mules, and they FINALLY get it all sorted out after 20 million of our dollars gets wasted, then they go and change shit all over again. Once you get it all nice and smoothed out, leave it alone lol. If they would have done with what the Aussies did and make the GS with the 3800 RWD, I'd still be in one today. Even though some of the older transmissions weren't that strong, they were still WAYYYY better than this load of garbage. Look up the transmission in my 200 and see what comes up... Engineers and the EPA. Gotta love 'em.
Wait till these things are out of warranty. Price will drop like lead in the water. If you were to price out the components of the systems in the cars you'd soil your underwear. People think a $20k viper or a 15k AMG is within reach. Well they get the no spit treatment when they service it. Forget about paying a dealer or specialty shop to fix it and be damned if you use anything less than OE parts to service. The car won't be worth crap on resale


BPE2013@hotmail.com
 
I've actually heard really good things about this new 8 spd trans thats in all the SRT's for '15...gotta be tough to handle gobs of power and still stay in one piece.
 
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