3 Rd Gear Correction Kit

[chris718]

Kit is now available to fix 3rd gear.Extensive research has developed the real corrections for 3rd clutch flaring and failure and additional information for dual feeding and non dual feeding applications.
Valuable test data and results included.It includes a new seperator plate ,all necessary gaskets ,valve body mods and technical information.This kit is for use for people who already have any brand shift kit or stageright transbrake installed and have a weak or flaring or constant 3rd clutch failure.After my own extensive testing,2 well known and well respected members of this forum have tested it for me.They are Jakeshoe and Bison.All of us have had similar results.CKPERFORMANCE 3rd gear correction kit $ 49.99.Beinning in November these mods will be added to the CK SHIFT RECALIBRATION KIT.The price on the new kits will be $149.00.

 

[bison]

:biggrin:

 

[challengermike]

will this work with a non shift kitted trans?Mine already shifts hard with the stock X seperator plate with no mods.

 

[chris718]

yes it will.it has resized feed holes.may be all some need to improve shifts.

 

[challengermike]

When i get some cash i will order one,thanks.

 

[Clark6]

Kit is now available to fix 3rd gear.Extensive research has developed the real corrections for 3rd clutch flaring and failure and additional information for dual feeding and non dual feeding applications.
Valuable test data and results included.It includes a new seperator plate ,all necessary gaskets ,valve body mods and technical information.This kit is for use for people who already have any brand shift kit or stageright transbrake installed and have a weak or flaring or constant 3rd clutch failure.After my own extensive testing,2 well known and well respected members of this forum have tested it for me.They are Jakeshoe and Bison.All of us have had similar results.CKPERFORMANCE 3rd gear correction kit $ 49.99.Beinning in November these mods will be added to the CK SHIFT RECALIBRATION KIT.The price on the new kits will be $149.00.

wish i could've gotten this months ago it was EXACTLY what i needed

 

[87GN_70GS]

So what was the issue found that this kit solves?

 

[TurboBuRick]

I need this Chris. Do you take credit card? You want to swing by and throw it in for me too? lol!

 

[jakeshoe]

So what was the issue found that this kit solves?

The stock circuitry for the shift to 3rd gear has to kick off the 2nd band and apply the 3rd clutches all at once.
Various mods are done with every valve body kit on the market to speed up the 3rd apply and correctly time the 2nd band kickoff for proper timing to prevent a flare of a bind up, either burns the clutches/band.

While not the guru that Chris is on the 200-4R hydraulics, I've tried almost every VB kit on the market. TransGo, PTS, Art Carr, CK, etc.
What I've seen on the units is that you can get a good shift at most throttle angles but often what makes a perfect WOT shift leaves a little to be desired at part throttle.

You get either too harsh all the way around, or sloppy at part throttle with a bang at WOT, etc.

I've come up with a setup that works well without using an aftermarket kit using some advice from several people on this forum. Chris has come up with a few mods to his kit and has had me and Bison try them on our builds for independent results.

The first part of this mod came about almost a year and a half ago. I happened to have a build going together and in a car I would be driving at the time, so I tested it for Chris.
It fixed the part throttle sloppiness of a dual fed unit.

So Chris came up with a new seperator plate design for this part of the kit. it saves alot of time when building the unit.

He recently came up with another mod that makes it even cleaner.

The one I was playing with 2 days ago, I built, had an odd VB/governor issue. Fixed that and added the most recent mod to the VB while I had it apart.

The part throttle shifts were very crisp and clean (dual fed unit, all billet) with very nice FIRM WOT shift, but not a "bump" feeling like the timing was off a bit.

The mods shorten the circuit and reduce fluid volume used unnecessarily when going to 3rd.

 

[S10xGN]

...It fixed the part throttle sloppiness of a dual fed unit...

Whoa, could you enlighten me on this? I'm getting ready to build my trans (rec'd all my parts from CK about 6 weeks ago) and plan on dual feeding. This is an LS-1 powered street car. Hadn't heard any reports of sloppiness before...

 

[jakeshoe]

If you got the CK valve body kit, you should be good to go, it will take care of the part throttle shifts.
You can call him or me and go see if you have the updated parts, did you get the new seperator plate?

Jake

 

[bison]

Whoa, could you enlighten me on this? I'm getting ready to build my trans (rec'd all my parts from CK about 6 weeks ago) and plan on dual feeding. This is an LS-1 powered street car. Hadn't heard any reports of sloppiness before...

which vb are you using?

 

[S10xGN]

For all: What exactly is the issue with sloppiness? I've been reading this forum for 9 yrs and never heard any mention of this before...

If you got the CK valve body kit, you should be good to go, it will take care of the part throttle shifts.
You can call him or me and go see if you have the updated parts, did you get the new seperator plate?

Jake

My reciept is dated 8/14, when I ordered, there was no mention of this. However, I got the master rebuild kit with the recalibration kit included (if that helps). IIRC, that part was $449 and change. I'll try and call Chris Monday.

which vb are you using?

The core is a CQ from an '85 MCSS.

 

[jakeshoe]

It's been covered here in the past.

The dual feed mod is the best way to get the direct clutches to live at any real power. It has (had) a couple of drawbacks.

One of the major drawbacks early on was the lack of or the expense of the forward drum needed. The WOT 2-3 shift with the dual fed 200-4R is like it should be, very crisp and firm, no slippage as the clutches come on.
Since the directs come on so positively, the direct drum is static in 2nd, not turning, when engaged the drum spins up to engine rpm instantly. It is being driven by the forward drum, and the power coming into the shaft of the input drum snaps the drum at the weak area where the splines terminate and the lube/pilot hole is drilled too deep.

So the forward drum takes the load of the 2-3 shift, and if it isn't upgraded, the dual feed is going to break it just because of the fact it brings the clutches on without slippage.

The pricing has gotten very reasonable on the FWD drum. I feel Chris has brought the prices to reasonable levels with his innovation of new parts and methods.

The 2nd issue with the dual feed is the slightly sloppy shifts at part throttle.

We do all the normal mods for firmer shifts, better band and clutch clamping, shift timing, etc.
The 2nd band must be kicked off as the 3rd clutches are applied. This happens at the servo. The servo is essentially the 2-3 accumulator. You control the 3rd shift firmness by the servo size, servo return spring tension, 3rd feed orifice sizing, and servo (band release) orifice sizing.

When you dual feed the band release sizing needs to be slightly different than on a non dual feed unit, to prevent a tie-up or bind up on the 2-3 shift.

Most kits reroute the fluid in this area of the seperator plate by plugging a hole (PTS, Transgo, CK, etc) this allows you to have control over the orifice sizing. You then drill the small hole to the proper size. On a non-dual feed unit, it would usually end up around .110" and result in good shift timing at all throttle angles. No bind-up, and the 3rd gear shift will be as firm as it gets with a non-dual feed unit.

If you drill this hole too big, you get the dreaded 2-3 flare. Too small you get a friction burning or parts breaking 2-3 tie-up.

When you drill this hole larger for dual feed it has a tendency at part throttle, say idle to 1/3 throttle, or normal light throttle operation for shifts to not be as positive as they should be compared to other throttle angles. It's really not detrimental to the trans because there is no load on the clutches, however if you are a picky builder, it is unacceptable.

The new mods take care of this plus more

 

[bison]

For all: What exactly is the issue with sloppiness? I've been reading this forum for 9 yrs and never heard any mention of this before...



My reciept is dated 8/14, when I ordered, there was no mention of this. However, I got the master rebuild kit with the recalibration kit included (if that helps). IIRC, that part was $449 and change. I'll try and call Chris Monday.



The core is a CQ from an '85 MCSS.

Call Chris and get the update. Tell him you just bought a kit in August. Its an easy install.