The car has a classic FAST with 83#ers
This car has already run 10.35@ 130 weighing in at close to 3800#s
This is the same motor we are stroking.
4.1 stroker
- Thread starter 85 t-tizzle
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The car has a classic FAST with 83#ers
This car has already run 10.35@ 130 weighing in at close to 3800#s
This is the same motor we are stroking.
Adam Connell
Monster Truckin since 87'
- Joined
- Oct 1, 2006
- Messages
- 969
Wow 274 is pretty big! It's actually adding over 1cly worth of displacement over a stock 231(if that makes sense)... Interesting, I bet those would be rockin street engines! 
Definitely interested in how this turns out!
Definitely interested in how this turns out!
- Joined
- May 26, 2001
- Messages
- 9,208
This is a non stage block,The guy wants to test the limits of a production 4.1 block. /QUOTE]
This was done many years ago, about in the mid-90', before there were "boards, he was on the GNTTYPE "list" and we had a great discussion about his project.
A guy, Fred, wanted to build a killer 4.1 for a hybrid use, and did not have the availability of the many after market forged, and other parts to help durability. With his build, he obtained over 700 HP on an engine dyno. True to his word, just north of 700 HP, it failed.As I recall, the block gave up?
Based upon his "inspiration", I then built a 4.1 block that was given to me. It had a cast crank, stock rods, a girdle, hard block and alum heads. Using Felpro 1026 head gaskets, this was a very reliable mid-10's combination using a TE-45A.
We have done a few 4.1's since then, not stroked though. With good heads and other parts combo, the problem with a 4.1 build on the street, is so much low end torque it is hard to keep the tires from spinning even with good rubber!
The 4.1 stroker we are finishing has all forged internals, hard block, good flowing alum heads with receiver grooves for use with copper gaskets and an o-ring in the block. We expect this combo to run reliable high 9's with a GTQ-70 turbo.
Based on info from other local GN's we have done with 109 blocks running high 9's, we should need only 20-21 psi of boost. Since we will not see temps below 100 degrees at the track until September, it will probably not be run before then.
- Joined
- May 26, 2001
- Messages
- 9,208
When we hard block a Buick V-6, the water ports for the pump are kept functional. This will only cover up to about 1" of the bottom of each cylinder.
We have seen little if any affect on cooling when this is done.
My original 4.1 which had hard block in it was sold to a customer in CA. He used it as a daily driver and never had cooling issues.:smile:
HARD BLOCK & Other
This is a non stage block,The guy wants to test the limits of a production 4.1 block. /QUOTE]
This was done many years ago, about in the mid-90', before there were "boards, he was on the GNTTYPE "list" and we had a great discussion about his project.
A guy, Fred, wanted to build a killer 4.1 for a hybrid use, and did not have the availability of the many after market forged, and other parts to help durability. With his build, he obtained over 700 HP on an engine dyno. True to his word, just north of 700 HP, it failed.
Based upon his "inspiration", I then built a 4.1 block that was given to me. It had a cast crank, stock rods, a girdle, hard block and alum heads. Using Felpro 1026 head gaskets, this was a very reliable mid-10's combination using a TE-45A.
We have done a few 4.1's since then, not stroked though. With good heads and other parts combo, the problem with a 4.1 build on the street, is so much low end torque it is hard to keep the tires from spinning even with good rubber!
The 4.1 stroker we are finishing has all forged internals, hard block, good flowing alum heads with receiver grooves for use with copper gaskets and an o-ring in the block. We expect this combo to run reliable high 9's with a GTQ-70 turbo.
Based on info from other local GN's we have done with 109 blocks running high 9's, we should need only 20-21 psi of boost. Since we will not see temps below 100 degrees at the track until September, it will probably not be run before then.
I am new to the hard block concept, meaning I don't quite understand it's purpose although I have heard of quite a few people using it.
Can this be used on a street car or will the engine have trouble cooling? And is the purpose to eliminate cylinder wall deflection? Just trying to think of it from a theoretical stand point I don't see any other advantage.
Additionally in horsepower, what does it take our full weight cars to get into the 9's?? I was looking at some stuff shouldn't we expect around 1.5 HP per cubic inch and with 274 CI that is around 390 - 400 hp and then double the atmosphere with an efficient turbo. Won't that net you roughly 700 at around 14 - 15 psi?
Reason I am asking is I have a 4.1 stroker going together with a set of the champion heads and the RJC girdle and I am thinking that if the tune is on point the thing should #1 live and easily make north of 700.
- Joined
- May 26, 2001
- Messages
- 9,208
Hopefully, your question about hard block was answered above.
As far as 9's in a GN with a 4.1 at 15 psi, my opinion is it will not happen?
You could go with astronomical compression ratio and 15 psi and maybe get there a few times. Best I have seen is 20 psi on a high $$$ TA alum build in a GN at a 9.80.
Of course a good day [or night] for racing here we have a density altitude of 3800'. Maybe at sea level or below, and GREAT flowing heads and intake, you may get a 9.9 run at 15 psi?
Just one more comment about 9 sec. runs, you best have an ample fuel supply or you will be asking for trouble. My experience is that even a double pumper will NOT do the job. Just pulled a 9 sec. engine that proved this point. He was pissed after just 6 runs on his fresh build, and then taking out 2 new pistons.
We are now installing a fuel cell and complete fuel system with the "fresh" engine!:smile:
As far as 9's in a GN with a 4.1 at 15 psi, my opinion is it will not happen?
You could go with astronomical compression ratio and 15 psi and maybe get there a few times.
Best I have seen is 20 psi on a high $$$ TA alum build in a GN at a 9.80. Of course a good day [or night] for racing here we have a density altitude of 3800'. Maybe at sea level or below, and GREAT flowing heads and intake, you may get a 9.9 run at 15 psi?
Just one more comment about 9 sec. runs, you best have an ample fuel supply or you will be asking for trouble. My experience is that even a double pumper will NOT do the job. Just pulled a 9 sec. engine that proved this point. He was pissed after just 6 runs on his fresh build, and then taking out 2 new pistons.
We are now installing a fuel cell and complete fuel system with the "fresh" engine!:smile:
subscribing
Ditto
ttypewhite
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Oct 1, 2001
- Messages
- 4,156
Otto, any updates on this project?
I was at BPG this weekend,Mat was gonna pic the motor up.
Im not sure if he did nor not.
Updates will comes
BEATAV8
The Engine Whisperer
- Joined
- Feb 14, 2002
- Messages
- 5,644
Interesting thread.
I'm wondering though... by the time a stock block is beefed up enough to do the job (buying a good core, square decking, line bore, girdle, caps, fasteners, washing, etc) the cost has to be over $2k dumped into a production block which is still stuck with 8 head bolts. Does it make more sense to just go with an off center 4" bore TA block?
I'm wondering though... by the time a stock block is beefed up enough to do the job (buying a good core, square decking, line bore, girdle, caps, fasteners, washing, etc) the cost has to be over $2k dumped into a production block which is still stuck with 8 head bolts. Does it make more sense to just go with an off center 4" bore TA block?
