I don't believe the officer should have taken his gun out in the first place, based on the video, the situation did not call for it. But I agree with Sean, that the officer had that 'What did I just do look on his face'. I don't think it's something that the officer will ever forget, and I can just imagine the sleepless nights he will face over this. But he still has to pay for killing that young man regardless whether or not he meant to kill him. The fact remains the the kid is dead! I know if it was me that shot that kid, there would be no question of the consequence, there should be no question in this case either!
BART-Bay Area Rapid Transit (Police Shooting w/ Video)
- Thread starter GNBRETT
- Start date
Raymond Bunch
"Turbo Enthusiast"
- Joined
- Mar 20, 2002
"At the news conference, the Grant family attorney, John Burris, said he understood the frustration that African-Americans"
I have yet to understand these statements.
If you are American you are American, if you are Canadian you are Canadian, British, etc, etc.
Quite simple, or so I would think; someone please tell me valid reason to be other than that?
My family goes way back as other than Canadian, I do not call myself by that.
I am not by any means trying to slam anyones Heritage.
Thanks AJ
I have yet to understand these statements.
If you are American you are American, if you are Canadian you are Canadian, British, etc, etc.
Quite simple, or so I would think; someone please tell me valid reason to be other than that?
My family goes way back as other than Canadian, I do not call myself by that.
I am not by any means trying to slam anyones Heritage.
Thanks AJ
And.... What does it feel like???
I have a very close friend on the force, but he's not a Sergeant or I'd have all ready tried it.
Quite interesting to see a 300lb man drop like a sack of Potatos, it must pack quite a punch
I find my self laughing at the Drunks getting tasered, takes them a second to
notice they are on the ground (5 seconds later)
It was quite an experience to say the least. But when the five seconds are over the discomfort is gone and thats it.
If I had the choice of the two I think I would rather be Tasered than pepper sprayed! The pepper has a long lasting effect with alot of discomfort.
Raymond Bunch
"Turbo Enthusiast"
- Joined
- Mar 20, 2002
When I went through Marine Security Guard School/Diplomatic Security with the State Department we had to get pepper sprayed. We had to go through this training not only to understand the effects of pepper spray and the medical attention afterwards but, to also defend our selves under an attack.
Just put it this way, If I had to choose, I'd rather be tased....
fastlikeanascar
Its never fast enough !!
- Joined
- May 4, 2008
This is a terrible situation I live not to far from the bay area & frequent there alot...
To be honest the Fact that it can be watched over & over on youtube is makin the situation so much worse.. think to be able to watch the last minutes of your sons, husbands & or fathers life on you tube..
its terrible & I too feel for both Families
To be honest the Fact that it can be watched over & over on youtube is makin the situation so much worse.. think to be able to watch the last minutes of your sons, husbands & or fathers life on you tube..
its terrible & I too feel for both Families
GNBRETT
Pelennor Fields
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2004
My thoughts were the same until I got Tasered. It's definately the more humane way of handling the situation because it is over in five seconds and gives the officer the opportunity the control the suspect and there are no after effects. OC spray hurts and blinds but it does not prevent the suspect from continuing to fight with the officers. OC spray also has a tendency to not only spray the eyes of the suspect but usually the eyes of other officers and innocent bystanders.
I have been hit with both and even tho the OC spray will last up to 45 minutes I would still take that over the Taser again any day. The Taser is not utilized to inflict pain. It's there to stop the suspect from resisting long enough to give the Officer enough time to restrain him or her from fighting with you.
The fact that it was taking (3) officers to contain this schmuck on the ground is exactly why the reason a Taser is drawn from an Officers belt. How long should an Officer have to struggle with someone before a Taser is drawn? (1) minute, (3) minutes, (5) minutes? I see some of you think that the Officers had the situation under control and there would have been no need to draw his Taser? Maybe you were watching a different video?
If it's taking (3) Officers to restrain this moron then it's evident that he had no intention of complying with their instructions to put his hands behind his back. Ever try handcuffing someone who is drunk and belligerent that dosen't want to be handcuffed? It's a lot harder then it looks!
It's easy to monday morning quarterback and say what you would have done in that situation but I can assure you that in our department you are given one warning to comply and if you refuse you will be Tasered and brought under control immediately without further risk of injury to the officer or the suspect.
Those officers showed great restraint by attempting to handle this moron with their hands as long as they did. Personally I think it was foolish and he should have been Tasered the second he chose to fight. Lets not forget that were only seeing part of the video.
It's not McDonalds, you don't have a choice and you don't get to take your time to think about what you want and how your going to do it. Watch the video again and watch all the people that begin to approach the officers as they are struggling with this moron. The longer it goes the more people flock to the scene. The more people flocking to the scene endangers the officers safety.
Did the Officer f-uk up? Of course he did. But that schmuck should have been Tasered the second he was brought to the ground. If he was brought to the ground then he was obvioulsy not complying with the officers commands while standing up.
mr go fast
Member
- Joined
- Aug 8, 2007
Why was the father of a young girl out fighting at 2am in the morning? Why did he not just be civil when more than one officer on the scene? Let me tell you one thing as a man of color.
1. more than two cops you dont say a damn word
2. more than two cops with weapons drawn...turn into the beaver
3. handcuffed with more than two cops...pray for only an ass ****pin.
"Urban" kids today have no respect for law let alone their own lives. Look what they do to their own neighborhoods. Did anyone see riots when the gay community protested prop 8 in CA. Makes you think doesnt it. I was crazy when I was young. I got in fights all of the time. How long of a disturbance was it to have all of the officers show up. You brawl get it done and then be gone. There is no excuse for what happen but if you dont want drama in your life...live responsible. Im constantly hearing f@(*#& THE POLICE. But when it comes down to them needing help, you wont see them saying a damn word.
1. more than two cops you dont say a damn word
2. more than two cops with weapons drawn...turn into the beaver
3. handcuffed with more than two cops...pray for only an ass ****pin.
"Urban" kids today have no respect for law let alone their own lives. Look what they do to their own neighborhoods. Did anyone see riots when the gay community protested prop 8 in CA. Makes you think doesnt it. I was crazy when I was young. I got in fights all of the time. How long of a disturbance was it to have all of the officers show up. You brawl get it done and then be gone. There is no excuse for what happen but if you dont want drama in your life...live responsible. Im constantly hearing f@(*#& THE POLICE. But when it comes down to them needing help, you wont see them saying a damn word.
TURBOPOWERED68
David
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2006
Let me start with Thank you for the great work you guys do, if it wasn’t because of you guys it would total chaos
I was going to say a bunch of stuff but after looking at you LEO’s locations (NJ and CT)
Yes Sir No Sir Sorry Sir even if I did nothing wrong Sir I must still do as you say Sir because while outside of a court room you are the only one with legal writes Sir and I am just a civilian looking to get arrested Sir. Thank you Sir for not arresting me even though I did not break any laws Sir. Are you guys these type of cops I hope not but by some of your statements it looks like some of you might be.
The cop did a terrible thing BTW I think it was by accident But he should pay the price for it just like if a CIVILIAN had done the SAME terrible thing. You guys become cops by choice (I could be wrong) or desire to follow your predatory instincts legally. As I believe 90% of all cops are predators (not a bad thing) but something that’s needs strict guide lines.
You guys have Power over any one on the street and are free to do as you wish with very little PERSONAL accountability and yet you want more Power. Get your dam search warrants for those garbage bags and stop complaining.
I would like to see you guys (LEOs) get pulled over by some of the cops that pulled me over in ENY just for you to see the BS law abiding civilians have to put up with. That wouldn’t work BECAUSE the first thing you guys do is show your badge. What about the tuff guy in the bar that reaches for his badge when he is about to get beat down. What about the A$$hole in the club that pushes his way through but when he is approached for it he reaches for his badge. It goes both ways you have a$$holes on both sides of the fence. The law must be applied to both sides equally which you guys know never ever happens.
also if your job sucks that bad get another job the last thing i want is to get pulled over by cop that hates his job anything could happen.
I was going to say a bunch of stuff but after looking at you LEO’s locations (NJ and CT)
Yes Sir No Sir Sorry Sir even if I did nothing wrong Sir I must still do as you say Sir because while outside of a court room you are the only one with legal writes Sir and I am just a civilian looking to get arrested Sir. Thank you Sir for not arresting me even though I did not break any laws Sir. Are you guys these type of cops I hope not but by some of your statements it looks like some of you might be.
The cop did a terrible thing BTW I think it was by accident But he should pay the price for it just like if a CIVILIAN had done the SAME terrible thing. You guys become cops by choice (I could be wrong) or desire to follow your predatory instincts legally. As I believe 90% of all cops are predators (not a bad thing) but something that’s needs strict guide lines.
You guys have Power over any one on the street and are free to do as you wish with very little PERSONAL accountability and yet you want more Power. Get your dam search warrants for those garbage bags and stop complaining.
I would like to see you guys (LEOs) get pulled over by some of the cops that pulled me over in ENY just for you to see the BS law abiding civilians have to put up with. That wouldn’t work BECAUSE the first thing you guys do is show your badge. What about the tuff guy in the bar that reaches for his badge when he is about to get beat down. What about the A$$hole in the club that pushes his way through but when he is approached for it he reaches for his badge. It goes both ways you have a$$holes on both sides of the fence. The law must be applied to both sides equally which you guys know never ever happens.
also if your job sucks that bad get another job the last thing i want is to get pulled over by cop that hates his job anything could happen.
GNBRETT
Pelennor Fields
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2004
I have read some ignorant and retarted posts before, mostly from Red but yours take the cake? What is that you do for a living? You probably hide behind some desk and answer phones in your protected little environment. I doubt it has anything to do with putting yourself in harms way day in and day out. Have you ever even been in a confrontation you little coward?
Do you think the Police are called out to the scene because someone wants to tell them what a great day they are having? They are called out 90% of the time because there is a problem that usually resorts in some sort of physical confrontation. You think they are called out to the scene so some azzhole like you can tell them what a great day they are having? Get a clue!
You think most cops choose this career because they have predator instincts? Are you a complete retard? If not, you certainly appear to be.
Cops dont have any more authority then any other civilian does. The constistution applies to everyone equally. The only difference between a Cop and a civilian is if a criminal committs a crime a Police officer is mandated by law to act. Unlike cowards like you who would quiver and run away and hide inside your car and call the police from your cell phone vs. intervening and putting yourself in harms way...
What makes you think cops hate their job? What, because one cop in CA did a stupid thing all cops now hate their job? You sound like a complete idiot! You sound like one of those cowards who got his azz kicked every day in High school and are still pissed off about it.
Search warrants for garbage bags are designed to catch Identity thiefs, Drug dealers, Pedofiles, Rapists, etc... Maybe your have a guilty conscience about something?
Maybe you should stop driving like an azzhole and then you wouldn't get pulled over in the first place. Did that ever cross your mind?
Why dont you try running your mouth to a cop in a club and see how many of your teeth get knocked out vs. him "Reaching for his badge" to hide behind it....
You have been watching too much TV. In case you don't keep up with current events a Cop is more likely to be prosecuted for a crime then a civilian because prosecutors like to make examples out of them. Prosecutors have descretion but they rarely use it when it involves a Police officer. So your impression that cops are impervious to prosecution is about as far off as the rest of your cowardly comments.
i rarely discuss politics or opinions because i am so far to the right that i offend virtually everyone -------everyone that knows me well knows to never bring up politics or legal issues or else suffer------ this incident like most irritate me when i see the family think they are somehow entitled to 25 million--------heres my ultra-ultra right super conservative opinion-------people that resist arrest by law enforcement deserve to be shot-------i don't think cops should have to fight people at all-------it shouldn't be a part of their job description-------ignore or resist and expect to get shot--------crowd control at riots???-------whats with all the silly riot gear, helmets, shields etc???? ------a few well placed bursts into a crowd with an automatic weapon will quell the worst mob instantly-----i see idiots throwing rocks at cops and i can only be thankful i am not a cop cause i wouldn't stand for that more than the time it would take to pull my gun---------negotiators?????-------somebody wants to commit suicide???????-------pull the trigger and help them out--------death watch in jail?????-------whats with this nonsense--------equip the cells with a gallows and save the court cost--------this loser trying to fight several cops with guns?????-------thats only because he knows the liberal losers and weak conservatives that govern our nation restrict the cops with "manners"------i have a strong belief that we need to be responsible for our actions and if we didn't get so many undeserved breaks we would be a much more civilized society---------i'll take bets that loser doesn't have 10 grand in the bank and hasn't earned more than 2 million $ in his entire adult life-------hows that make him worth 25 million dead???????????---------the worlds better off without him---------its his fault he's dead and i feel for the cop just trying to do his job--------if i was selected for this jury there is no amount of evidence that could bring me to convict that cop--------if i scare you don't worry you will never see me in your jury-------i have never been selected for a jury-------the lawyers dismiss me the instant i start answering their questions...............RC
mr go fast
Member
- Joined
- Aug 8, 2007
wanna talk about it? :biggrin:
turbov6joe
Signal 1 J-12
- Joined
- May 22, 2002
Well put Richard, I could not have said it better myself!!! When I started in law enforcement in 1990 the world of law enforcement was a much better place. ****bags not so much feared us...they respected us! If you ran your sewer...you got the crap whacked out of you. If you took a swing on me...you got beat down. If you pulled a gun...I didn't beg you to put it down out of fear of being on trial for giving you 2 to the head and 1 to the chest. If you ran from me...I chased you until either my motor blew or I lost a tire...even then I still chased you as far as my car would go. If you took off on foot...my dog bit the crap out of you until you quit resisting. Now our hands are tied so bad law enforcement has become a complete joke in most parts of the world. When I was in Saudi Arabia for the 1st gulf war I witnessed fist hand the respect the Saudi Police had from their citizens...so much so that most of then did not have to carry a weapon....seriously! I thought to myself, if only most of the citizens of the great USA had 50% of the respect for their law enforcement as the citizens of other countries do...the USA would be a better/safer place to live. Now that I'm coming up on my 19th year of beimg an LEO I look forward to being done with this mess and never looking back. I feel so sorry for the new cops coming out of the academy and the BS they now and will deal with. Being a cop is the only thing I know other then working on cars...and even that I wouldn't want for a full time job. I'll ride out my next 12 years till I can retire and who knows what from there...that is if some punk ass mother flipper doesn't whack me first. Cheers, I need another beer!
TURBOPOWERED68
David
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2006
I have read some ignorant and retarted posts before, mostly from Red but yours take the cake? What is that you do for a living? You probably hide behind some desk and answer phones in your protected little environment. I doubt it has anything to do with putting yourself in harms way day in and day out. Have you ever even been in a confrontation you little coward?
Do you think the Police are called out to the scene because someone wants to tell them what a great day they are having? They are called out 90% of the time because there is a problem that usually resorts in some sort of physical confrontation. You think they are called out to the scene so some azzhole like you can tell them what a great day they are having? Get a clue!
You think most cops choose this career because they have predator instincts? Are you a complete retard? If not, you certainly appear to be.
Cops dont have any more authority then any other civilian does. The constistution applies to everyone equally. The only difference between a Cop and a civilian is if a criminal committs a crime a Police officer is mandated by law to act. Unlike cowards like you who would quiver and run away and hide inside your car and call the police from your cell phone vs. intervening and putting yourself in harms way...
What makes you think cops hate their job? What, because one cop in CA did a stupid thing all cops now hate their job? You sound like a complete idiot! You sound like one of those cowards who got his azz kicked every day in High school and are still pissed off about it.
Search warrants for garbage bags are designed to catch Identity thiefs, Drug dealers, Pedofiles, Rapists, etc... Maybe your have a guilty conscience about something?
Maybe you should stop driving like an azzhole and then you wouldn't get pulled over in the first place. Did that ever cross your mind?
Why dont you try running your mouth to a cop in a club and see how many of your teeth get knocked out vs. him "Reaching for his badge" to hide behind it....
In case you don't keep up with current events a Cop is more likely to be prosecuted for a crime then a civilian because prosecutors like to make examples out of them. Prosecutors have descretion but they rarely use it when it involves a Police officer. So your impression that cops are impervious to prosecution is about as far off as the rest of your cowardly comments.
Thanks for proving my point With your rant and insults. And this was just letters on a screen I can only imagine what you would have done to me if I said it to your face. Teaser, night stick, shot Or you would have beat me up then arrest me for hitting an officer. Which one?
And what I said in my above post is all stuff I have wit nest first hand. Did I strike a nerve with you if I hurt your feelings I’ll man up and apologize for it, So Sorry if I hurt your feelings. But that doesn't change anything that I saw for my self. If my statements don’t apply to you why are you so bent about them? Do they apply to your friends? Or you just refuse to admit that you have cops that act the way I described. You gotta be kidding if it’s the last one.
You’re going to tell me that the "job" doesn't require predatory traits/instincts.
1-Hidding behind a bush waiting to catch a speeder. I could be wrong.
2-Posing as a user to catch a Dealer. I could be wrong.
Like I said "NOT A BAD THING" but you missed that. It’s OK to see thing one way.
I admit that I am not a tough guy like you. But I’ll put my hands up win or loose not a problem with me. The lumps go back down and the pain goes away in a few days.
I also tell you this I don't walk around with a gun, never have. I don’t go out drinking with friends and bring A gun with me. I also don’t leave the house with A gun just to go to 711. I also don’t bring a gun with me to the restaurant to have diner with the wife and kids. Nope I don’t do any of these things
And yes I have been in 27 confrontations with equal size opponents with no weapons besides my hands. And countless amount of hours training. But that was a long time ago.
I did repo work in Flatbush and Canarsie but I didn't like getting shot at and not having a gun to shoot back with so I got another job.
So I drive like an azzhole give me the ticket and that’s it. Why the extra BS.
when I get pulled over I don't say a word I hand over the papers I get a ticket and life goes on I don't blame the cop for giving the ticket that’s his job. But when the POS makes you stand in the rain or knell on your hands yeahhh he is a POS for it.
I will not insult you or call you names it’s just not productive plus if you are an honest Cop I wouldn't want to disrespect you in anyway. Your job is tough enough and I have great respect for honest cops.
I understand your need to "put me in my place" while defending all cops.
But I am honestly telling you the things I have seen first hand. And the BS I have had to put up with from the cops in my old neighbor hood. Really look at all the cops around you, not one of them is an undercover coward that hides behind his badge? Not one of them over steps just a little and every one else lets it go. Look closely you will find one or two.
Brett I only wish you the best and a safe return home to your family everyday I really mean it. reread my above post maybe the second time youll see that i wasn't talking about all cops.
I have a few more personal horror stories if you want I can share them with you. You wouldn’t believe the ship I have dealt with over the years
GNBRETT
Pelennor Fields
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2004
Then take it out on the cop that you had a problem with. Giving all of us a black eye because you had a problem with a few cops has nothing to do with the rest of us.
TURBOPOWERED68
David
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2006
I agree with this. I should have been clear with my statements which are meant for the 75th precinct, Brooklyn south and Brooklyn North of the 80s and 90s unless some of those specific POS are still on the job. And I have made about 12 Civilian complaints. And to who? The Civilian complaint review board that is composed of cops.
I have been pulled over by Nassau County PD (most recently),
MD state police, NJPD and the NY state police and I have no hate for them in fact I they should help train the NYPD.
I gave them my papers they gave me a ticket or warning no extra BS and life was all good.
But to say ALL cops are saints is just as wrong.
Even thou the % of good cops has to be above 95% I just happen to come across the other 5% when I am in NYC.
TURBOTERRORV6
The Street killer V6
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2005
As a former LEO,i have saw quite a few things in my life. My honest opinion, this rookie cop made so MANY mistakes its unbelievable!.. My views as a former officer are outside the box's. i Never once let my frustration on a public civilian, instead put my training what i was thought in the force. i agree with you with some terms, the more people that flock around a situation,makes a hostile enviroment be handle at a safe distance. But you do not pull your weapon out when the suspect is subdued in the ground espicially when you have your partner inches away from getting SHOT.
If a cop is not getting civilian complainants, he/she is not their job. I have had complainants againast me but they were all make up BS lies.
How many times did you call the police for a good incident/situation?
How 'bout this one. There were 4 officers on scene. Stop a car with 3 young adults. One of the passengers had weed on him. He got arrested and was placed in the back of the patrol car. While the PO was issuing the driver a summons, one of the passengers had called the arrestee's parents. By the time the PO had finished writing the summons, the parents arrived and were breaking out their son from inside the marked unit. Now there is a full assault on the officers. Parents & passengers vs. officers. The father got his ass kicked. Who in the right mind would want to break out someone inside a PD unit? Now their is lawsuit against the PD, town, officers from the father for getting his ass kicked.
You know many excuses I hear if one gets caught doing some traffic infraction. I stop a driver going through a red light. Driver says, it's was yellow. I tell them OK, and write 'em for going through a yellow light. They admitted to breaking the law. I'm not a big traffic ticket writer but I write for obvious violations. If I stop you speeding, you're speeding. If the driver says the truth, they have a better chance of getting off with a verbal warning.
Society is becoming a place where blame is placed on someone else.
Were mistakes made in BART, yes.
Billy T.
gnxtc2@aol.com
How many times did you call the police for a good incident/situation?
How 'bout this one. There were 4 officers on scene. Stop a car with 3 young adults. One of the passengers had weed on him. He got arrested and was placed in the back of the patrol car. While the PO was issuing the driver a summons, one of the passengers had called the arrestee's parents. By the time the PO had finished writing the summons, the parents arrived and were breaking out their son from inside the marked unit. Now there is a full assault on the officers. Parents & passengers vs. officers. The father got his ass kicked. Who in the right mind would want to break out someone inside a PD unit? Now their is lawsuit against the PD, town, officers from the father for getting his ass kicked.
You know many excuses I hear if one gets caught doing some traffic infraction. I stop a driver going through a red light. Driver says, it's was yellow. I tell them OK, and write 'em for going through a yellow light. They admitted to breaking the law. I'm not a big traffic ticket writer but I write for obvious violations. If I stop you speeding, you're speeding. If the driver says the truth, they have a better chance of getting off with a verbal warning.
Society is becoming a place where blame is placed on someone else.
Were mistakes made in BART, yes.
Billy T.
gnxtc2@aol.com
TURBOTERRORV6
The Street killer V6
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2005
agree with you,just like Lawsuits...
GNBRETT
Pelennor Fields
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2004
No one is arguing that the cop screwed up. He resigned two days later. The video pretty much shows that deadly force was not authorized.
If you have never let your frustrations out on the public then you don't work where I and thousands of others work.
It's human nature, it's gonna happen from time to time when your dealing with civilians that are often drunk, ignorant and live in poor drug and gun infested nieghborhoods who have nothing, had nothing and probably never will have anything. They grow up hating the police because most of thier family members freedom was taken away by the police at one time or another.
That might be your view where you worked but where I work it's violent and bottles and bricks tend to hurdled your way sooner then latter during a hostile event. When we are in a hostile situation we contain the suspect ASAP with whatever means we have and put them in the police car and move to a safer location.
That is if we can make it out of the projects without having our windows blown out by rocks or bullets.
If you worked in a little sleepy bedroom town town most people will obey the laws and it won't be an issue. When your work in the ghetto with a bunch of animals those rules don't apply.