Before Black BS'ing thread.

[dr_frankenstein]

OK gentlemen,

yes I reckon im the worse for hi-jacking.... but I think we need our own kinda lounge thread where we can feel a little more at home.

the rest of the board is fun... but I really feel like a step child out there cause im Hybrid... and carb turbo..... dont really fit the rest of the crowd.

Anyways...... if its cool with yous guys.... maybe we could just update our progress and BS about other stufrf and not ruin real tech threads.

does that sound ok? Charlie what do you think?

Anyways..... I will start by continuing the chat we started on Mikes 79 sport coupe thread.

AWWWWWWWWW! I feel warm and fuzzy Aj.:biggrin: LOL I'll make the two of you a deal. If you'll find a track fairly equal distance between the three of us Aj, maybe we can all meet up for some fun.:smile: Since you've got the faster puter available and a little more time during the day to do it I'll leave it to you. We might even make a B4B event since it should be fairly close to the center of the country. Tell me what you guys think? Maybe the week after Noble next year sounds good.

Sorry about the hijack Mike but this happens sometimes when the three of get together.

Can you Imagine an all B4B meet? it would be real interesting to see how many other b4b cars are hidden out there! sounds like a definite plan!

A.j.

 

[83turbomon]

OK gentlemen,

yes I reckon im the worse for hi-jacking.... but I think we need our own kinda lounge thread where we can feel a little more at home.

the rest of the board is fun... but I really feel like a step child out there cause im Hybrid... and carb turbo..... dont really fit the rest of the crowd.

Anyways...... if its cool with yous guys.... maybe we could just update our progress and BS about other stufrf and not ruin real tech threads.

does that sound ok? Charlie what do you think?

Anyways..... I will start by continuing the chat we started on Mikes 79 sport coupe thread.







Can you Imagine an all B4B meet? it would be real interesting to see how many other b4b cars are hidden out there! sounds like a definite plan!

A.j.

Like the People who eat the pizza pockets outside.... we need our own little gang or crew... I love it... make and host a B4B website... and make bsing allowed:biggrin:

 

[dr_frankenstein]

Like the People who eat the pizza pockets outside.... we need our own little gang or crew... I love it... make and host a B4B website... and make bsing allowed:biggrin:

well i was talking just for this site in meantime...

just cause I feel like i tend to clog threads with all kinds of nonsense cause i like to hear myself talk. LOL

i dunno, ive been on alot of other forums, and they have always all had a BS thread or two....

kno what i mean man? like i could toss up a pic of a new part I got, or work thats finished, or a half nekkid woman - without starting a thread that only will be seen for a few days then travels down the list to never be seen again.

A.j.

 

[usetaboost]

oh yeaaaah, it's gonna be a crap thread My specialty, talkin chit:biggrin:

Here ya go for the beginning of my crap http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/turbo-lounge/300890-every-time-i-get-mad-my-wife-i-remember.html

 

[dr_frankenstein]

Agh thank you!

see that wasnt sooo bad.... and now we can talk **** to each other easily.

Like how im gonna beat the pants off of Charlies car next year.

A.j.

 

[usetaboost]

please tell me you watched that video...

 

[dr_frankenstein]

please tell me you watched that video...

absolutly

like a normal day at my house.

A.j.

 

[charlief1]

Well?

OK gentlemen,

yes I reckon im the worse for hi-jacking.... but I think we need our own kinda lounge thread where we can feel a little more at home.

the rest of the board is fun... but I really feel like a step child out there cause im Hybrid... and carb turbo..... dont really fit the rest of the crowd.

Anyways...... if its cool with yous guys.... maybe we could just update our progress and BS about other stufrf and not ruin real tech threads.

does that sound ok? Charlie what do you think?

Anyways..... I will start by continuing the chat we started on Mikes 79 sport coupe thread.

Can you Imagine an all B4B meet? it would be real interesting to see how many other b4b cars are hidden out there! sounds like a definite plan!

A.j.

I'll see if Shane is willing to make a sticky so we can do just this.:biggrin: Maybe we can start a trend of old muscle for all of us "red headed step chidren" after all. I like the fact that Shane has the Turbobuick.com nats but we each have our priorites and it's a little different from the rest. What I'd like to see is a racing class that we can compete in that would level the field, so to speak. Done on the basis of original ET to current ET in a percentage. Jesse and I have hd this discussion before and both of us have been shouted down by the powers that be for now. I'll see if Shane might be open to the idea and maybe we can get it started for all of us.:biggrin:

 

[charlief1]

Agh thank you!

see that wasnt sooo bad.... and now we can talk **** to each other easily.

Like how im gonna beat the pants off of Charlies car next year.

A.j.

It's' not my pants your gonna beat Aj. It's your D!ck.:biggrin: LMFAO If things work out you're gonna be using my turbo design after all.:biggrin:LOL I may have someone willing to help me on the work for free so cross your fingers guys.:smile:

 

[dr_frankenstein]

It's' not my pants your gonna beat Aj. It's your D!ck.:biggrin: LMFAO If things work out you're gonna be using my turbo design after all.:biggrin:LOL I may have someone willing to help me on the work for free so cross your fingers guys.:smile:

well what i would really love to do is get your turbo ontop of my weiand intake and see how it acts,

I swapped the compressor housings from the carbed turbo onto a hot air unit.

WHAT a difference the HA turbine makes! boost comes on almost instantly - but doesnt come up all that high, maybe 6 to 7 lbs tightented down pretty good, is it possible with the single plane under it, the flow improved enough to catch up to the .43 compressor? maybe.... so Im thinking your compressor turbine combo will be a hot ticket for a minimal mod carb turbo system.

But that stock intake HAS to go..... Do you have a gasket from the pontiac 301 turbo foot you could measure? i would like to pattern the adapter plates to fit that foot as well.

A.j.

 

[charlief1]

Since you're using an adaptor on the Weiand intake you should make a second to adapt the 301 T housing and then you'd be good. I'll see if I can take some measurements of the foot as well as pics for you Aj. Then all you'd need to do is make the adaptor to use the inducer side of the 301 T. I didn't come up with the idea on my own though. Phillbuilt is the one that gave me the most info so he really deserves the credit, not me.

 

[dr_frankenstein]

Since you're using an adaptor on the Weiand intake you should make a second to adapt the 301 T housing and then you'd be good. I'll see if I can take some measurements of the foot as well as pics for you Aj. Then all you'd need to do is make the adaptor to use the inducer side of the 301 T. I didn't come up with the idea on my own though. Phillbuilt is the one that gave me the most info so he really deserves the credit, not me.

Nice.... I think that 301 compressor will really up the power potential so I just need to find one now.

I have to say the only thing that sucks about it is, the height.... man its like 4 inches taller then the factory one.... so its crappy for anything under a stock hood. but might be cool for a cowl induction hooded car.

what do you think about selling the adapter kit? wil come with the modified exhaust parts, the 4bbl plate, and the brackets to attach the turbo. looking at the labor, and materials.... say 450 for an upgrade? I think that sounds resonable?

A.j.

 

[charlief1]

Nice.... I think that 301 compressor will really up the power potential so I just need to find one now.

I have to say the only thing that sucks about it is, the height.... man its like 4 inches taller then the factory one.... so its crappy for anything under a stock hood. but might be cool for a cowl induction hooded car.

what do you think about selling the adapter kit? wil come with the modified exhaust parts, the 4bbl plate, and the brackets to attach the turbo. looking at the labor, and materials.... say 450 for an upgrade? I think that sounds resonable?

A.j.

Well...I do still have 1 turbo I haven't taken apart Aj and Jesse just sent me the old one he had on his 86 so I have enough for one more. As far as height you could get one of the 4.1 intakes and do the mods to it so it would be shorter. Making a "kit" may work but you'd have to include a stub pipe so the down pipe could be fabricated as well. I was thinking if I ever get this thing done I could do something simular as a turbo upgrade and sell the whole thing includng down pipe for $15-1800. Do a complete set up for the factory intake with a new up pipe and external waste gate tubing in place. Then all you'd need to do is pick the waste gate of your choice and go.

 

[dr_frankenstein]

Well...I do still have 1 turbo I haven't taken apart Aj and Jesse just sent me the old one he had on his 86 so I have enough for one more. As far as height you could get one of the 4.1 intakes and do the mods to it so it would be shorter. Making a "kit" may work but you'd have to include a stub pipe so the down pipe could be fabricated as well. I was thinking if I ever get this thing done I could do something simular as a turbo upgrade and sell the whole thing includng down pipe for $15-1800. Do a complete set up for the factory intake with a new up pipe and external waste gate tubing in place. Then all you'd need to do is pick the waste gate of your choice and go.

aww i see! the stock 4bbl intake! hadnt considered that!

I cheated for the exhaust, i bought a stock HA elbow with an added 3 inch flange on the side with a 1 foot dump tube... not the cleanest... but looks scary.

The neat thing charlie, is on the HA turbine with a carbed compressor, the exhaust sytem is really close to stock, and is easy to mod to fit. more a matter of adding a few inches of material to the straight sections on the up pipe. even a stock HA downpipe fit my elbow perfectly with just a short section added. so maybe it wont cost tooo much.

A.j.

 

[charlief1]

aww i see! the stock 4bbl intake! hadnt considered that!

I cheated for the exhaust, i bought a stock HA elbow with an added 3 inch flange on the side with a 1 foot dump tube... not the cleanest... but looks scary.

The neat thing charlie, is on the HA turbine with a carbed compressor, the exhaust sytem is really close to stock, and is easy to mod to fit. more a matter of adding a few inches of material to the straight sections on the up pipe. even a stock HA downpipe fit my elbow perfectly with just a short section added. so maybe it wont cost tooo much.

A.j.

The 86-87 design may also fit but I want to go external for other reasons Aj. Much better control of the boost is one of them. The fact that I won't have that bend on the outlet will allow for a much better flow of the exhaust out of the turbo and I can clearance whatever I need to allow for anything else I want to do. I also have an 84-85 turbo here and it looks simular but the later one seems to have the edge on the design slightly. That's why I chose it instead of the HA one.

 

[dr_frankenstein]

The 86-87 design may also fit but I want to go external for other reasons Aj. Much better control of the boost is one of them. The fact that I won't have that bend on the outlet will allow for a much better flow of the exhaust out of the turbo and I can clearance whatever I need to allow for anything else I want to do. I also have an 84-85 turbo here and it looks simular but the later one seems to have the edge on the design slightly. That's why I chose it instead of the HA one.

I agree 100% with ya Charlie, the only reason I went with the HA unit was cause I had a good one, and its the same size compressor housing. made for an easy swap to a better turbine. not the best.... but a little better.

do you think boost control will be an issue? Alot of internal gates seem to hold well to 25lbs or soo... how high are you planning on pushing your boost?

with the temps at 80* outside here, i get a discharge temp of around 230* at around 10lbs of boost on the .43 compressor (taken from port on foot) and thats kinda scary on 93 octane alone. I figure by looking at the map for the 301... at 10lbs of boost I would imagine a discharge temp of around 190 due to the better efficiency.

so even at 20lbs, i imagine the discharge temp will be around 280* so discharge temp being the limiting factor in boost.... I just dont know if the added complexity of the extrnal wastegate would be worth it at under 25lbs of boost?

I dunno.... just thinking...

A.j.

 

[Skylark-69]

Just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in. Still collecting parts and been studying performance combos and turbos. Figure the TE-44 would be good for 12's. Still planning on twin turbos after I get some experience under my belt with a single. I only need one more T3 turbo...muwhahahaha.

Other than that just waiting to see who has their HA system up and running first.

 

[charlief1]

I agree 100% with ya Charlie, the only reason I went with the HA unit was cause I had a good one, and its the same size compressor housing. made for an easy swap to a better turbine. not the best.... but a little better.

do you think boost control will be an issue? Alot of internal gates seem to hold well to 25lbs or soo... how high are you planning on pushing your boost?

with the temps at 80* outside here, i get a discharge temp of around 230* at around 10lbs of boost on the .43 compressor (taken from port on foot) and thats kinda scary on 93 octane alone. I figure by looking at the map for the 301... at 10lbs of boost I would imagine a discharge temp of around 190 due to the better efficiency.

so even at 20lbs, i imagine the discharge temp will be around 280* so discharge temp being the limiting factor in boost.... I just dont know if the added complexity of the extrnal wastegate would be worth it at under 25lbs of boost?

I dunno.... just thinking...

A.j.

The two biggest factors you're forgetting is the change in the AR as well as the bigger wheel. If you're seeing a temp of 230 at 10 lbs you should drop an equivelent temp to the percentage of the change in AR. Aproximatly 184 degrees if my math is right. Now if you add a small amount of E-85 to the mix (20%) that along with an actual alky injection system you should be able to drop to around 150 for the inlet temp At that rate you should be able to get 25 to 28 lbs with out causing a problem.

The reason I want the external is ajustability. I can use a controler from inside the cab to change the setting and vary it to what ever I want, all the way down to a 3 or 4 lb if I want for better milage.

Just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in. Still collecting parts and been studying performance combos and turbos. Figure the TE-44 would be good for 12's. Still planning on twin turbos after I get some experience under my belt with a single. I only need one more T3 turbo...muwhahahaha.

Other than that just waiting to see who has their HA system up and running first.

Since you want a double set up I think you may have gotten a little to big. It's all gonna depend on overall effeciency of the engine before you add the turbos to it. You really need to talk to JayC or Patrick about this before you get into it to far. Patrick works for precision and he should be able to point you in the right direction.

 

[Skylark-69]

The two biggest factors you're forgetting is the change in the AR as well as the bigger wheel. If you're seeing a temp of 230 at 10 lbs you should drop an equivelent temp to the percentage of the change in AR. Aproximatly 184 degrees if my math is right. Now if you add a small amount of E-85 to the mix (20%) that along with an actual alky injection system you should be able to drop to around 150 for the inlet temp At that rate you should be able to get 25 to 28 lbs with out causing a problem.

The reason I want the external is ajustability. I can use a controler from inside the cab to change the setting and vary it to what ever I want, all the way down to a 3 or 4 lb if I want for better milage.



Since you want a double set up I think you may have gotten a little to big. It's all gonna depend on overall effeciency of the engine before you add the turbos to it. You really need to talk to JayC or Patrick about this before you get into it to far. Patrick works for precision and he should be able to point you in the right direction.

I plan to use a single turbo first just to learn what works etc. The twin turbo set-up would be two T3's or maybe two T3/T4 hybrids.
Is that what you meant by too big? Or were you saying the single TE-44 was too big?

 

[charlief1]

My mistake. I thought you were going to use two T44's instead of doing a single.