Give it all away Pres. Bush

[Captain Mark]

....hmmmmm.......I am still trying to figure out what is driving this whole thing.

We need cheap labor here inthe US. Sorry, but we just do. I know I do not want to pour concrete for a living, and roof houses for a living. (Although I have done both of those things when I was younger) We need people here who are willing to do those jobs. I don't think they are taking many jobs away from Americans, because Americans don't want the jobs.

That being said, this is a bad proposal. Who signed the NAFTA bill...was that George senior?

Little George has laready been kissing Vincente Fox's rear for years...I just can't figure out why.

Lotsa oil in the Gulf of Mexico.

 

[TurboTer]

If they really want to solve the immigration problem, just build a huge wall and militarize the boarders. If that doesn't work, add landmines and give the agents shoot-to-kill orders. I'm sorry if this sounds extreme, but it will stop the illegal immigration problem dead in its track.

Bush and his neo-cons don't get tough on immigration or propose to make Engliish the official US language because of the Hispanic vote. Likewise, they don't push to ban affirmative action because of the black vote. Someone ought to tell them they are wasting their time, because these two groups will never vote Republican anyway.

 

[ThikStik]

Pouring cement or roofing a house was worth doing awhile back. I can remember beautiful young girls working the burger joints in the 80's and back. 20 years ago, I broke my back doing grunt work and it was worth it. Went to school without debt or any parental help. In fact, a blue collar man at one time in America could earn a living. No more. You get paid way less and things cost way more. College costs are out of control.
Notice how many horror stories are on this site regarding shoddy work on their cars. Craftsmen arent getting paid enough so they dont care.
Is it the fault of illegals, not really. They are a side affect of a problem. Some of the problem is NAFTA, some of it is vanity on the part of America, blue collar work is looked down on. How wrong! Some of it is a capable yet lazy non working class of peoples that are a product of liberal entitlements. Some of it is a bigger class of super rich.
It is years of bad policy that produced the problem. It should be addressed from within America. It is wrong for Mexico to capitalise upon our mistakes.
Yes, this all is a foregone conclusion.

 

[Red Regal T]

Originally posted by UNGN
This is exactly right. Bush hasn't DONE anything. He PROPOSED a bill that will be voted on by YOUR representatives in congress.

Clinton and many of the current Democrat candidates have proposed Executive Orders to do similar things. No vote, no debate.

That's right......Bush didn't do anything. It's up to congress to make up legislation, debate it, vote on it and then up to the President to sign it. I don't like the whole idea of it but I don't have to like everything that is done. I like most of what Bush has done and there certainly is no alternative to George Bush as President. Reagan also addressed the immigrant problem and actually gave an amnesty. Clinton, like all the other dems, just promises the world, but does nothing but give themselves raises and increase taxes.

 

[granatl]

Originally posted by soonergn
... you used to hear every once in a while about the mostly Black gangs killing each other in the north part of town. Now we've started to hear about Hispanics killing other Hispanics. We don't have a big problem with murders but when it happens you hear about it. On the other hand I've known some Hispanics that were respected citizens and welcome in the community.

This is actually the real problem (IMHO), and why so many Americans don't won't an open-door policy for immigrants. Although statistics show that violent crime has slightly decreased in the past few years, it's not enough. The humanitarians say it's unjust for us to shoot those that break into our house, steal our cars, etc. Imagine how quickly crime would disappear if THE law was changed to something like this "In the event of crime, the victim, or if needed, the family of the victim has the ultimate say in the sentencing of the criminal with no punishment considered as too harsh." Bullets are much cheaper than the $50k/yr per prisoner.
My co-worker has said "Eye for an eye and the world goes blind."; but I instead think there would be a lot less "eye poking."
Give me a politician that puts the power of judge/jury/executioner back in my hands!

 

[sixgun86gn]

The main problem with illegal immigrants (not the legal ones mostly)is that they want the american life but live like animals.They destroy their own way of life by standing idle in their own country.Then they come here and live absolutely filthy.I install elevators.Sometimes on large construction projects.The illegals on the job eat their food and leave trash everywhere and will piss or crap in any dark corner,only for you to step in it when your working.I cant count how many times I have picked up something out of a crate that reaked because it had been pissed all over!They ruin the area with their trash and crappy smoking cars.Add to that that they are extremely poorly educated which makes them hard to deal with already.

I agree with Mark on the fact that they are doing jobs that americans don't want,but they also don't obey our laws.Lets see ...they don't carry auto insurance and drive like s#$%,so when they have an accident its tough crap for the victim.They steal S.S.#s and ruin peoples credit.They work for next to nothing so its obvious why they tend to steal things on jobsites.I don't blame them for wanting to come here ,but they can at least try to live like they are a decent human being.Thats why the ones with green cards aren't near as bad because they want to improve themselves.The illegals do not.

I hope if this thing goes through that it is a way to weed them out instead of perpetuate a cycle that is bad enough already.I have no problem with immigrants.I have a problem with the trouble that we go through with the illegal ones.

 

[GNSCOTT]

Its easier to make them citicens and tax them since some way in California they can already collect welfare and get healthcare. We need more people to fill low paying jobs. Americans will not flip burgers anymore.

 

[granatl]

sixgun86gn- Your second paragraph applies to everyone, not just Mexicans.
I never worked in construction, so I'll have to take your word on the condition of the sites.
I live in Las Vegas. Trust me, I know what they're like. But everything bad I can say about them, I can apply to every other race too. I live in a minority neighborhood (because of the rapid growth, neighborhoods are commonly a melthing pot). 2 Xmas' ago, the Mexican neighbor played "oompa-oompa" music outside in their backyard from Xmas eve through Xmas morning. But there's a lot of other races that will drive by with loud music and fart can exhausts.
The simple fact is no one cares about anyone other than themself anymore. They are never the ones that can't admit wrong, etc.

 

[ross87t]

The "melting pot" is mixed. WE DON'T NEED ANYMORE DAMN SPICES ADDED!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[2quiktocare]

First off, this is not an amnesty program by any means. The fact everyone is pissed off about it means it must be a best possible situation. This will give us a tool to manage who is coming and going and will set things up so we can audit movements and gain some true and meaningful information about how much money the illegals pay in and what they take out of our economy. This does not open the borders, it actually will give us more control over them. True it is not what I would like to see what happens with this all, but it is a meaningful direction to start in. It is better than just setting back and whinning as has been done for so long now. Let's give it a chance and see how it all works. They are here and keep coming. At least this will give us a chance to bounce anyone that won't play by the rules.

 

[2quiktocare]

Captian Mark, the was Bill Clinton that signed NAFTA by the way

 

[Pronto]

Originally posted by TurboTer
that skinny little poor excuse for a general liberal swine Wesley Clark.

Graduated 1st from West Point, Rhoads Scholar, Wounded 4 times, Silver Star, Commanding General at Fort Hood, Commanding General in Panama, Supreme Allied Commander of Europe.
Have you ever commanded troops?

 

[sixgun86gn]

Jack,did I say Mexicans?No I did not.Please do not put words in my mouth.I said Illegal immigrants and that does mean every possible kind.They are illegal because it does not benefit them to become legal citizens.Just think....no record of fingerprints to trace you to,no credit history(but the one you stole).The list can go on and on about what illegal immigrants in this country are capable of.Yes ,I was talking about illegal mexicans as that is the major problem in TEXAS.I know nationality has nothing to do with what an illegal does.You seem to have missed my point.No flaming intended.

 

[csierra]

Thickstik

Thickstik,
I totally agree with what you said. Blue collar workers do not get enough respect in this country. Blue collar workers use to be able to make a living and support a family, but now struggle just to make ends meet.

 

[TurboTer]

Originally posted by GNSCOTT
Its easier to make them citicens and tax them since some way in California they can already collect welfare and get healthcare. We need more people to fill low paying jobs. Americans will not flip burgers anymore.

Yes we will. Flipping burgers at $6.00 per hour is a perfectly good job for a 16 year old REAL American.

 

[TurboTer]

Originally posted by Pronto
Graduated 1st from West Point, Rhoads Scholar, Wounded 4 times, Silver Star, Commanding General at Fort Hood, Commanding General in Panama, Supreme Allied Commander of Europe.
Have you ever commanded troops?

He's a scambag and a traitor. He authorized the assault on Waco that led to the murder of over 80 Americans. He also fully supports Americans fighting under UN command and was involved in the UN war in Kosovo (Balkins). Show me one high ranking white military man besides him that supports both affirmative action and gay rights. Guess what? You can't, because he's the only one.

 

[6pack]

Originally posted by 2quiktocare
Captian Mark, the was Bill Clinton that signed NAFTA by the way

2quicktocare..you are correct........"Bubba" signed the NAFTA bill!

 

[Captain Mark]

Originally posted by 6pack
2quicktocare..you are correct........"Bubba" signed the NAFTA bill!

Sorry about that mistake boys. BUT, I believe the Bush's (either one of them) would also sign the bill. Don't get me wrong, I voted for the Bush's and will vote for little George again. I don't have to agree with everything they do.

One other problem I see with so many immigrants here. They make money here and then send it back home instead of spending it all here. Therefore, the US money is used to support another country. That's not good for us.

I know a lot of these folks are here to better themselves, and I admire that. If I was in their posotions I would want to do the same thing. BUT......if you are gonna come here, you must abide by our rules, our laws, our customs, our language....etc....etc America has set a high standard for the rest of the world. If you want to come here and be a part and a contributor to this high standard, then come on. If you are gonna come here and try to make America the crap hole you just left....then we don't need you. Just my opinion boys, and nothing else.

 

[bishir]

I have some different views. I personally don't see Immigration as that big of a problem. Most that I'm aware of are some hard working son of guns. I'd like to see that kind of work attitude out of some legal citizens. I would probably be right in speculating that we all know someone that has worked the system and is collecting disability or suing some company so he/she can sit at home and do nothing. Plus, what kind of jobs are really lost to mexican workers anyways? It's not like they are taking the really good jobs. Yes, they may be taking some manufacuting jobs, but that's when the companies move there. I know a few people back in the Midwest that work at a US car company's asymbley plant making 100k a year running a machine. I'm not saying they don't work hard, but why should workers expect so much to push a button on a machine when people like teachers make 25k a year. I'm afraid some American Unions, govermental policies toward corporations. and general coporate greed have done more to influence immigration than our president declaring amnesty. JMO....


James

 

[Randy Greenoe]

Originally posted by bishir
I have some different views. I personally don't see Immigration as that big of a problem. Most that I'm aware of are some hard working son of guns. I'd like to see that kind of work attitude out of some legal citizens. I would probably be right in speculating that we all know someone that has worked the system and is collecting disability or suing some company so he/she can sit at home and do nothing. Plus, what kind of jobs are really lost to mexican workers anyways? It's not like they are taking the really good jobs. Yes, they may be taking some manufacuting jobs, but that's when the companies move there. I know a few people back in the Midwest that work at a US car company's asymbley plant making 100k a year running a machine. I'm not saying they don't work hard, but why should workers expect so much to push a button on a machine when people like teachers make 25k a year. I'm afraid some American Unions, govermental policies toward corporations. and general coporate greed have done more to influence immigration than our president declaring amnesty. JMO....


James

Did you ever work in an automobile assembly plant? I did as metal finisher,and let me tell you
sanding by hand 65 hoods and fenders an HOUR is no day on the beach. It appears as though everyone thinks if you work in a factory is all you do sell on your butt and complain. They sure pump out alot of vehicles considering all the lazy union cry babies are doing nothing but setting on their duffs whining and crying. As far as teachers making 25k a year come on now ,I have a brother in law who is a teacher and makes more than double that and has about four months vacation a year. Blame the unions for negotiating a fair wage? The contract that EVERY union has negotaited has been agreed to by the company! No guns were put to their heads to accept the package that was presented to them. They agreed that it was a labor package that they could live with and THEY accepted it.