Head gaskets

[johnplogii]

Looking for experiences both good & bad with the different head gaskets available. I was running felpro 1007 wirelocs & lifted both heads. I was told you have to use 200,000 psi arp studs & not the 180,000 ones by a reputable source. These would be the easiest to use as I have receiver grooves in the heads. Just looking for other experiences.

Thanks

 

[Brer Rabbit]

Cometics and headbolts here.

I went with Cometics and arp headbolts. I feel this is the safe way to go especially on a new motor during the tuning process. This way there is room for errror. I mean the bolts will allow the head to lift instead of melting a piston. Since I used Cometics, a simple retorque will put me back on the road. I know this works because it happened to me. Now that the car is dialed in, I may go with head studs, for the 27# passes.

 

[10SECONDVSIX]

I was running felpro 1007 wirelocs & lifted both heads.
Thanks[/QUOTE]

The reason you lifted both heads like we all did is because Fel Pro screwed up on the Instructions. That is if you have the Instructions where is says to Groove .008". The correct depth of the Grooves should be .012" deep.
Many did that mistake like I never went back to Fel Pro.
If you still have the Grooves, check the depth before shaving them off.

Best I have seen so far are the Cometics and the SCE Coppers like I am running now and it's been 2 years @ 30 lbs of boost and never retorqued nor have blown them yet.

Good Luck

Joe

 

[johnplogii]

Thats very interesting. We checked the other day and my groove depth was .008-.009". Do you run o-ring wire with the coppers? How many runs on them? I did get about 500 passes from the 1007's but about 200 were after the heads lifted.

Thanks

 

[10SECONDVSIX]

Their's your problem. Back in the late 90's I got fed up about hearing everyone having the same proble. So I called Fel Pro tech support. They told me this that was very funny. " For a street Car the Groove should be .008" but for Drag Racing the groove has to be .012" that is not specified in the Instructions".
That was enough BS to never run Fel Pro's again.
On my Heads I installed S/S Wires for extra sealing. O Rings stick out .040".
I sprayed some Gasket Tack on both sides. Head Studs torqued at 80 - 85 lbs.
That's it. No Leak. No Blow by. Nothing....


Joe

 

[Alky V6]

I've been using Felpro stainless wirelok for a long time now with amazing results. I agree that the groove dimensions and accuracy is very important. The Cometics and SCE gaskets look good too. I used Cometics on a customer's car with good results. I would suggest that if you're looking for a bullet proof setup, no matter whose gasket you use, USE ARP STUDS!! Don't fool around on this one.

Another secret to making head gaskets last. Avoid severe detonation.

 

[10SECONDVSIX]

Their's your problem. Back in the late 90's I got fed up about hearing everyone having the same proble. So I called Fel Pro tech support. They told me this that was very funny. " For a street Car the Groove should be .008" but for Drag Racing the groove has to be .012" that is not specified in the Instructions".
That was enough BS to never run Fel Pro's again.
On my Heads I installed S/S Wires for extra sealing. O Rings stick out .040".
I sprayed some Gasket Tack on both sides. Head Studs torqued at 80 - 85 lbs.
That's it. No Leak. No Blow by. Nothing....


Joe

I want to make a correction that the total Wire is .040" and 1/2 of it was in the Head....

 

[johnplogii]

Well I called fel pro and conley's & they both said to follow the instructions exactly (.008). Donnie, how deep are your receiver grooves?

 

[John Wilde]

John you may be better off with a MLS Type Gasket.
I don't think Duttweiler uses the 1007s much anymore.
Pretty sure he will use a standard type MLS on Chow's 109 motor.
What is Dan Strezo using these days???

 

[bison]

Their's your problem. Back in the late 90's I got fed up about hearing everyone having the same proble. So I called Fel Pro tech support. They told me this that was very funny. " For a street Car the Groove should be .008" but for Drag Racing the groove has to be .012" that is not specified in the Instructions".
That was enough BS to never run Fel Pro's again.
On my Heads I installed S/S Wires for extra sealing. O Rings stick out .040".
I sprayed some Gasket Tack on both sides. Head Studs torqued at 80 - 85 lbs.
That's it. No Leak. No Blow by. Nothing....


Joe

I ran the same thing for 4 years and thousands of 25+psi beatings. Never blew a gasket or had a piston problem. I ran the wire about .017 out and had a wider groove in the head. The wires were pressed in the block. Fwiw i did not perform a retorque on mine either. MLS gaskets need a retorque from my experiences.

 

[Alky V6]

Well I called fel pro and conley's & they both said to follow the instructions exactly (.008). Donnie, how deep are your receiver grooves?

I followed the instructions that came with the gaskets to the letter. Including the torque values.
USE STUDS!

 

[10SECONDVSIX]

Well I called fel pro and conley's & they both said to follow the instructions exactly (.008). Donnie, how deep are your receiver grooves?

That's not what Fel pro told me...Think for a minute. Why would it leak Water and Not Blow-bye! The Heads are not compressed enough....I went through this 10 years ago.

 

[Underboost]

I followed the instructions that came with the gaskets to the letter. Including the torque values.
USE STUDS!

Hey Don, If you use head studs you can't pull the head off w/ the A/C in the way right? You have to pull the motor with studs.

 

[buickstage II]

hey Joe,
1007's are pretty old technology now!
im rather interested in the SCE's, but what prep work is involved in the 'ics titans' (if that is what your using).
i ask this because reading their article it states "new ics titan, with built in combustion seal" and "integeral oil and coolant seals"
they state that there reuseable up to 6 times!
also what thickness you using.

cheers simon

 

[johnplogii]

Donnie, I do use head studs. Brent, you have to pull the motor to change the pass side but not the driver side I beleive.

 

[alittlev6]

Hey Don, If you use head studs you can't pull the head off w/ the A/C in the way right? You have to pull the motor with studs.

you dont have to pull the motor out to take out the heads. I pulled both heads out with AC, Just take out the bolts,and unscer the studs from the block with a GOOD allen tool.

 

[johnplogii]

My arp studs don't take an allen tool.

 

[Alky V6]

Hey Don, If you use head studs you can't pull the head off w/ the A/C in the way right? You have to pull the motor with studs.

If you get the studs that have the allen socket in the ends, you can pull them in the car.

(Read down further and noticed it was already mentioned)

As far as 1007s being out of date. If the technology still works, it's just another option in the tool box. No reason to throw it out the window. The prep required, and the accuracy level of the prep is what makes them undesireable.

 

[J-B Racing]

SCE Coppers

I am using the plane Copper Head Gaskets not the New Titans. I installed a set of .070`` think and followed their instructions on installing the O-Rings .100`` appart. I applied with a Paint Roller a thin coat of Silicone from GE and don`t ask for the # because it was the HG kit that was once purchased from RJC for a Customer. That Silicone is amazing. The # was removed from the Tube. It`s already the second time I am using the Gaskets.
( Changed Block ) once well cleaned with Brake Cleaner, they are as good as NEW.

Fel Pro # 1007 are old technology BTW...

Joe

 

[Alky V6]

I am using the plane Copper Head Gaskets not the New Titans. I installed a set of .070`` think and followed their instructions on installing the O-Rings .100`` appart. I applied with a Paint Roller a thin coat of Silicone from GE and don`t ask for the # because it was the HG kit that was once purchased from RJC for a Customer. That Silicone is amazing. The # was removed from the Tube. It`s already the second time I am using the Gaskets.
( Changed Block ) once well cleaned with Brake Cleaner, they are as good as NEW.

Fel Pro # 1007 are old technology BTW...

Joe

Copper gaskets with wire orings is even older technology than the 1007s. Funny how the old tech keeps bouncing back, isn't it.