Hot air Hop Up

krusty

New Member
Please give me your feedback on the possible modifications I'm going to make on a customer's car. I am doing a frame-off resto of GN T-Type for the original owner, and we are not straying far from a stocker. Some bolt-on chassis stiffening, boxed rear arms, energy suspension bushings. Engine wise, we are planning on uprating the turbo to a TA33C (this fits the stock intake, right?), uprating the fuel pump, adding an adjustable f.p. regulator, '87 ECM and uprated injectors (recommended size?). The exhaust will be custom-built stainless headers, pipe, and downpipe (owner has a business relationship with a major NASCAR header mfr.) and hi-flow cat with Hooker true dual exhaust. The long block is getting rebuilt, blueprinted, and balanced. Cam recommendations would be appreciated (currently thinking Comp 208/208). We do not want to make major internal mods; this car will NOT be drag-raced. We will not be adding an intercooler. Owner just wants "a little more power". Any input appreciated. thanks, vic
 
This one is easy. The TA33C is a double the cfm of the stocker in the same housing. It is a direct bolt on to the intake. The problem with the stock exhaust is the passenger side exhaust header and the downpipe. Postons makes the passenger side header which helps alot. The real problem is the turbo elbow and the stock 2 inch downpipe. I had a custom 2 1/2 integrated downpipe custom built and it really makes a big difference. This downpipe eliminates the 90 degree turbo elbow. It is very expensive in stainless.
Forget the cam issue because at your level it is meaningless. The fuel injectors should be 30 lbs. Remember-fuel pump should be a Walbro 340 hotwired. Good luck. Brad
 
all good info above. As far as the cam just go with a 206/206 that will be the best setup for you and thats whats going into my 11's hotair motor.
 
I forgot to add that going from a 84/85 ECM to an 87 you really should upgrade the MAF to an 87 or a LS1 type with a translator. I would also get a MAT as well as upgrade the IGN and coil module to the 87 as well. If you are serious about this send me a PM and I will give you my phone number. Take care- Brad
 
You ought to give alcohol injection serious thought too. It cools and adds octane and allows you to run higher boost level. Julio (aka Razor) from AlkyControl has the best kit.
 
alky is a good thing but it looks like he just wants something alittle more then stock but doesnt want to go crazy. As far as the injectors i would go with the High Z 60's as once you go to the 87 ecm these will be just a drop in. I would call Turbo Tweak for a chip and let him burn something for you. yes 60's are alot of fuel but if the owner ever decides he wants to go faster he wont have to worry about not having enough fuel. i would run 60's on anything from bone stock to a low 10 second ride. As far as the turbo yes the Ta-33 will be a good upgrade and thats about all that out there for our cars. anyways i also sent you a pm.
 
Correct me if I am wrong but no matter what is done to improve performance without the octane from either race gas or alky he will be limited to stock boost levels without knocking.
 
TA33 is a great stock upgrade choice.

Cam: leave it stock. just my opinion. if your not looking for an 11 second car, then a cam is not needed.

Injectors: I'd go with 36 lbers. Bigger than stock (29#) and youll be able to take them into the low 12s easy.

All the other mods: excellent choices. Try to get a 2.5 inch (or 3 inch if you can) downpipe, either make a custom one with an integrated internal wastegate to eliminate the turbo elbow...OR find an ATR 2.5 inch downpipe somewhere (this is what im running, and just this mod made a huge difference in power).

You will need a new performance chip to match the bigger injectors; I recommend Turbo Tweak chips for these cars.

Good luck with all of that! :biggrin: :cool:
 
you are correct but where not 100% sure what he is lookig to get out of the car.



Exactly what I was thinking too. If he wants a little more than stock does he need all the nice extra go fast goodies. On my 100% stock engine I noticed a difference with just a fuel pump & hot wire, FPR, 87 ecm & chip, and 30 lbs'r at 13 lbs of boost.

Oh yeah, a posi rear is nice too :D not all of these cars had them.
 
I forgot to mention the headers...

If you're going to make your own headers, be careful not to make them too free flowing...Hooker makes a set for the 86/87 cars that is so free flowing it actually slows cars down, unless theyre already generating some serious power. Be careful when designing these so as to prevent bad turbo lag.

But...then again, if he works for Nascar, maybe he already knew that. :D
 
gn84turbo i have to disagree with your choice in injectors. putting 36lb injectors in the car is just plain waisting money. those injectors might be able to get you to the 12's if you have alky and push them really hard but if he wants to do more upgrades to the car later down the road and doesnt want to have 90%+ injector duty cycle then the 60's are a better choice. hell the 60's are just the right thing to do from stock to a 10 sec car. with the chip burners we have today it is a no brainer. i went from stockers to 40's to 55's if the 60's where out when i started it would have saved me money. but it all depends on what he wants to do if he doesnt want to do performace upgrades then the stockers will go along way
 
My bad,

I thought he wanted to have "a little more power," not a 10 second drag car. If you DO have intentions of ever going this fast, then they are worth the buy, i agree.

BUT IMO something about putting 60 lb injectors on a near stock engine seems like a bit much...? Just because you can have a chip burned for it...will it not still output more fuel at idle than stock or lower lb injectors? The bigger the injector size, the bigger the idle flow rate, right? Or am I way off here? Regardless, I think hed be running too rich with the 60s.

Injector Selection Guide

Check out this site..lets you calculate the flow rate you need based on horsepower...(300 horse = 36lb injectors, 500 horse = 60 lb injectors, with a BSFC of 0.6)
 
60lbs injectors can be made to work... If the desire is to build a car that the owner can later upgrade (customer decision on this call)... IMO 36lbs would work as well if it is the goal to obtain another 125 horses over stock which is where this build seems to be heading.

Simple changes to the motor could obtain that extra pick up and get what the customer wants. The turbo suggested works exceptionally well. I like the 206/206 camshaft and have used it in more than one combination... it works.

A higher stall converter, upgraded exhaust, and some free flowing headers could go far to wake this car up.
 
i agree if he doesnt ever plan to upgrade the car then there is no point just stick with the stockers.

Krusty so what does the owner really want to do? does he have anything planed for future mods?
 
No, he's not going to get caught up in future mods with this car, he just wants a little more than he remembers he had... Some of what we're doing, like headers and downpipe and some MSD stuff is because he has some business relationships with some mfrs. Since the turbo has to be gone through, I figgered the turbo upgrade was a no-brainer. Otherwise, just a nice balanced and blueprinted stocker. This car is not going to go to the drag strip or street race.
 
No, he's not going to get caught up in future mods with this car, he just wants a little more than he remembers he had... Some of what we're doing, like headers and downpipe and some MSD stuff is because he has some business relationships with some mfrs. Since the turbo has to be gone through, I figgered the turbo upgrade was a no-brainer. Otherwise, just a nice balanced and blueprinted stocker. This car is not going to go to the drag strip or street race.

Hard to give "advice" based on "a little more that he remembers" but I'll try to write down what you already know. :D Seriously, no pun intended!
Many may disagree, but here is my opinion:

Fully Ported/ Stock intake/Matched heads
Edit: Stock cam! (Hyd Roller with close to stock specs works well)
DP upgrade would help
Header upgrade (PS only)
Free flowing cat
TT chip (With stock or 87 ECM)
Good flowing air filter
Stock turbo! (keep stock converter)
Stock Ignition system! (if in good working order ...You have this covered)
Stock injectors
TUNE, TUNE, TUNE!

That should result in "a little more" than he remembers, pending the customers' "memory". Good luck!







(Did I mention "Tune"? :eek: )
 
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