If yours are 130/310 then id be concerned about that. I know part #941 has a red stripe if recently bought and are 130@1.75, 350@1.25 and work well on our engines up to 6000 rpm. I was running the same set for 4 years and they still werent a problem. They were on the high mile engine i cracked the piston on early this year. I was shifting at 5800-5900. Only had about .497 lift though.
Motor won't rev over 5200-5300rpm... WTF???
- Thread starter yullose
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If yours are 130/310 then id be concerned about that. I know part #941 has a red stripe if recently bought and are 130@1.75, 350@1.25 and work well on our engines up to 6000 rpm. I was running the same set for 4 years and they still werent a problem. They were on the high mile engine i cracked the piston on early this year. I was shifting at 5800-5900. Only had about .497 lift though.
You wanna sell me those springs and retainers back ?
Those will be put to good use very shortly. Had the pedestals welded up. I just need to clearance the heads for roller rockers and disassemble lap the valves and clean them.
These are a no go for sure and are most likely the problem if thats what is on there. No amount of shimming will help. You will coil bind before you get close on the pressures needed. These must have been installed in error. I dont see how this can not be an error on their part if they knew it was a hydraulic roller with your lift. Then again they may be ok at 1.7 installed and your lift. What is your installed height?Oh hell yeah... that will work on mine...
And, after doing some research on TA's website... the springs they put on my heads look like shimmed-up flat tappet springs.
V6 Valve Springs, V6 Dual, Super Valve Springs, 125#. Aluminum Heads, TA_V1125AL | TAPerformance.com
According to the build sheet, they used "TAV1125AL" valve springs on my build.
Here's the specs on those...
Well... as long as they were the blue strip 26918's, at least I know which ones I had with this cam before...
I'm sure my 1.65 rockers are heavier than stock stamped rockers that were on before... and the 1.94/1.6 valves weigh alot more than the stock valves... So I may even need a stiffer set of beehives than the blue stripes.
That is exactly the springs that are on my heads... the part number is on the build sheet I posted on page 1 of this thread.
Inst heights are 1.830-1.835 (see page 1 for all head/spring specs)
If they put the wrong springs on my heads, I will be fvcking furious. I was very clear with my cam specs and engine info.
1.83-1.85 seems like its a no go. I dont see how you will have enough pressure over the nose. The spring rate is not high enough.
So it looks like they sent me heads with flat tappet springs on them... How lovely.
I think the guy I dealt with at TA was "Tim"... Anyone know what his capacity is there or if I need to go higher up the chain of command ?
They will be getting a phone call and some questions tomorrow.
Hmmm... I spent $2900 on heads, valvetrain, headgaskets, head studs, valve covers, etc... and another $800 for the intake and hardware.
I sure hope they have some happy answers to my not so happy questions.
My engine is very similar to yours and i have the 26918 springs and shift at 6200-6300. No problems here. You should not have to be over 6100 with your cam.
TurboT231
Member
- Joined
- Jan 20, 2002
- Messages
- 151
Inst heights are 1.830-1.835 (see page 1 for all head/spring specs)
I've been following this thread for a few days hoping you could get it fixed.
Look's like if it is the springs you might want to go with the 26120 beehives, they should fit your TA heads. Mine were machined to use the wider 26120 which would probably give you some nice pressure at 1.83. Hope you get it figured out soon.
I've been following this thread for a few days hoping you could get it fixed.
Look's like if it is the springs you might want to go with the 26120 beehives, they should fit your TA heads. Mine were machined to use the wider 26120 which would probably give you some nice pressure at 1.83. Hope you get it figured out soon.I have the V1125 TA springs and my build sheet has:
.575 cam lift w/1.65 rockers
160 lbs. @1.805 closed pressure
360 lbs. @1.230 open pressure
Coil bind = 1.080
Looking at the Comp. beehives the TA's look like they are in line. There is .150 left to coil bind so 380+ lbs. should be possible and still have the minimum coil bind clearance.
PS: I see some of the "new" Beehives have 377 and 410 lbs. full open pressures
Note: I read a long time ago that all hydraulics can only take approx. 360/370 lbs. before they start to collapse but after seeing the high pressures on the "new" beehives I may get my pressures increased after talking to my head man.
Oh, and I have been to 6400 rpm's a time or two due to a slipping trans. with the TA valve springs.
.575 cam lift w/1.65 rockers
160 lbs. @1.805 closed pressure
360 lbs. @1.230 open pressure
Coil bind = 1.080
Looking at the Comp. beehives the TA's look like they are in line. There is .150 left to coil bind so 380+ lbs. should be possible and still have the minimum coil bind clearance.
PS: I see some of the "new" Beehives have 377 and 410 lbs. full open pressures
Note: I read a long time ago that all hydraulics can only take approx. 360/370 lbs. before they start to collapse but after seeing the high pressures on the "new" beehives I may get my pressures increased after talking to my head man.
Oh, and I have been to 6400 rpm's a time or two due to a slipping trans. with the TA valve springs.
Those pressures look fine for 6500 rpm
I just got off the phone with Mike at TA Performance.
He's a super nice guy and very willing to help.
He seemed to agree that my cam probably has very steep, fast ramps due to the shorter duration and high lift... and feels we should try more spring pressure. He's working on another set of springs for me right now.
Just to confirm it might be a valvespring issue, I took the car out again today just to see what happens if I hold it in gear... and sure enough, it made things worse. It managed to spin up to 5600 but was a complete blubbering mess. I'm now convinced it needs more spring pressure. I hooked the wideband back up today too... but the readings are all over the place, probably because the valves were floating or bouncing.
Mike is working on a setup that will put me at 160+ on the seat and 360+ open pressures.
I also ordered another set of rockers for it... this time in a 1.55 ratio.
I will do the springs first, and may just drop the slower ratio rockers on for good measure. Even with a 1.55 ratio, I still have .548" lift. I just wanted to have another ratio here to try if needed.
Mike said he will try to have everything in my hands by Friday... so hopefully I can get it squared away and maybe sneak-off to the dragstrip by the weekend.
He's a super nice guy and very willing to help.
He seemed to agree that my cam probably has very steep, fast ramps due to the shorter duration and high lift... and feels we should try more spring pressure. He's working on another set of springs for me right now.
Just to confirm it might be a valvespring issue, I took the car out again today just to see what happens if I hold it in gear... and sure enough, it made things worse. It managed to spin up to 5600 but was a complete blubbering mess. I'm now convinced it needs more spring pressure. I hooked the wideband back up today too... but the readings are all over the place, probably because the valves were floating or bouncing.
Mike is working on a setup that will put me at 160+ on the seat and 360+ open pressures.
I also ordered another set of rockers for it... this time in a 1.55 ratio.
I will do the springs first, and may just drop the slower ratio rockers on for good measure. Even with a 1.55 ratio, I still have .548" lift. I just wanted to have another ratio here to try if needed.
Mike said he will try to have everything in my hands by Friday... so hopefully I can get it squared away and maybe sneak-off to the dragstrip by the weekend.
My Moroso spring tester showed up today...
I can't vouch for it's accuracy, but not one of them got to 120lbs on the seat.
These pics were snapped just as the valve started to lift off the seat. No fudging the numbers at all...
#2 exhaust was just over 100
#2 intake was approx 115
I can't vouch for it's accuracy, but not one of them got to 120lbs on the seat.
These pics were snapped just as the valve started to lift off the seat. No fudging the numbers at all...
#2 exhaust was just over 100
#2 intake was approx 115
Dusty Bradford
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- May 24, 2001
- Messages
- 5,802
Just for future reference. Test your springs when you get them off. The seat testers can vary due to the rocker ratio. Just test yours when you pull them for reference during testing later.
That's exactly what I intend to do Dusty...
I spoke to Mike at TA again today for about 25 minutes... had a great conversation with him about a bunch of different things.
Anyway... he said he's sending me another set of inner springs and some .060 shims that should put me at 170/370-ish with my installed heights.
When I pull a couple springs off, I will run them up the street to the local machine shop and have the pressures checked against my build sheets.
I know these Moroso testers aren't textbook accurate, but I was really surprised to see my springs wouldn't even hit 300lbs when I compressed them all the way down to the valve seals... It must have something to do with the rocker ratio and the cheap tester...(Only $70)
Anyways... the benchtop tester at the local machine shop will give me more reliable numbers. I can't wait to see what they look like.
I spoke to Mike at TA again today for about 25 minutes... had a great conversation with him about a bunch of different things.
Anyway... he said he's sending me another set of inner springs and some .060 shims that should put me at 170/370-ish with my installed heights.
When I pull a couple springs off, I will run them up the street to the local machine shop and have the pressures checked against my build sheets.
I know these Moroso testers aren't textbook accurate, but I was really surprised to see my springs wouldn't even hit 300lbs when I compressed them all the way down to the valve seals... It must have something to do with the rocker ratio and the cheap tester...(Only $70)
Anyways... the benchtop tester at the local machine shop will give me more reliable numbers. I can't wait to see what they look like.
Well... now I'm fvcking furious.
I don't know how goddamn many phonecalls it takes to get things right... but this is just ridiculous.
Look at the inner springs TA just sent me... and tell me whats wrong with this picture. (hint - look at the one all the way to the right)
I called and talked to Mike. I was furious and trying my best to be polite and tactfull. He just transferred me back to the guy that did (****ed up) my heads, who happens to be the guy that swears he checked all 12 springs before shipping them.
I didn't just fall off the turnip truck, nor was I born yesterday.
There is NO FVCKING WAY these springs were checked on a scale. Tell me how the fvck you get the same spring rate from a spring with two extra coils on it ? YOU DON'T.
I wonder if he even looked at them when they got shoved in the bag.
There is just NO excuse for this level of incompetence when dealing with a company of this caliber.
I thought when I ordered all this stuff, I was ordering the best there was to offer. I didn't flinch at the prices at all... and in the last 2 months have spent well over $4000 with them.
I don't expect ANYONE to kiss my a$$ for my money... but when I spend good money, I expect quality in return... nothing more.
I even PAID for these corrected springs, AND the shims AND the 3-day select shipping so I would have them by the weekend.
Now here I sit with a mismatched pile of springs I have ZERO confidence in.
I'm about to just order a set of beehives and associated hardware and throw these TA springs in the garbage.
I'm so fvcking mad right now I can't think straight.
All this... on top of a mis-threaded head stud and a mis-formed rocker adjuster... which they ALSO charged me for when they sent a replacement.
I don't know how goddamn many phonecalls it takes to get things right... but this is just ridiculous.
Look at the inner springs TA just sent me... and tell me whats wrong with this picture. (hint - look at the one all the way to the right)
I called and talked to Mike. I was furious and trying my best to be polite and tactfull. He just transferred me back to the guy that did (****ed up) my heads, who happens to be the guy that swears he checked all 12 springs before shipping them.
I didn't just fall off the turnip truck, nor was I born yesterday.
There is NO FVCKING WAY these springs were checked on a scale. Tell me how the fvck you get the same spring rate from a spring with two extra coils on it ? YOU DON'T.
I wonder if he even looked at them when they got shoved in the bag.
There is just NO excuse for this level of incompetence when dealing with a company of this caliber.
I thought when I ordered all this stuff, I was ordering the best there was to offer. I didn't flinch at the prices at all... and in the last 2 months have spent well over $4000 with them.
I don't expect ANYONE to kiss my a$$ for my money... but when I spend good money, I expect quality in return... nothing more.
I even PAID for these corrected springs, AND the shims AND the 3-day select shipping so I would have them by the weekend.
Now here I sit with a mismatched pile of springs I have ZERO confidence in.
I'm about to just order a set of beehives and associated hardware and throw these TA springs in the garbage.
I'm so fvcking mad right now I can't think straight.
All this... on top of a mis-threaded head stud and a mis-formed rocker adjuster... which they ALSO charged me for when they sent a replacement.
- Joined
- Feb 18, 2006
- Messages
- 10,084
I thought I was the only one with that kind of luck.
And... if you guys think I'm crazy... here's the other crap I had to deal with right off the bat.
I never got a replacement stud... luckily I had a few oddball spares in my toolbox to substitute it. You don't need a pitch gauge to see it won't screw into the block. The other end is fine. Alongside it is another stud with the correct 7/16 thread.
Look closely at the rocker adjuster screw. The hex is too shallow to get a wrench in... TA sent me a replacement for it... but charged me $13.
No. I'm not crazy or over-demanding. I just have really crappy luck.
I never got a replacement stud... luckily I had a few oddball spares in my toolbox to substitute it. You don't need a pitch gauge to see it won't screw into the block. The other end is fine. Alongside it is another stud with the correct 7/16 thread.
Look closely at the rocker adjuster screw. The hex is too shallow to get a wrench in... TA sent me a replacement for it... but charged me $13.
No. I'm not crazy or over-demanding. I just have really crappy luck.
Ouch, now thats a pain in the azz. I been following this thread from the begining and if i were you i would do exactly what you just said. Take both sets of springs, retainers and keepers throw them in a box, ship them back to TA and get your money back. Save youself the hassel and piss around of setting up those coils up and order at set of beehives that you know will work on your setup.
Too bad this is turned in to such a run around but i think almost every member here has gone through something like this in one way or another. Sad, but its all apart of our hobby.
Too bad this is turned in to such a run around but i think almost every member here has gone through something like this in one way or another. Sad, but its all apart of our hobby.
