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STOCK turbo racing class, Any Interest??

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UNDER-PRESSURE

..... Member .....
Joined
Jul 16, 2006
Messages
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Are there any other members here who would be interested in a true STOCK turbo racing class? Just original, stock appearance Turbo musclecars shooting it out. I would like to get a list going to show any interest?
 
Rules were written last year. Shane built a car, and no one else did. I think it's a cool idea. :confused:
 
Are there any other members here who would be interested in a true STOCK turbo racing class? Just original, stock appearance Turbo musclecars shooting it out. I would like to get a list going to show any interest?

Please put me on the list. Thanks Shawn
 
Your thread says "stock turbo", but in your post you say "stock appearing turbo". Huge difference. :confused:
 
"Stock apperance turbo musclecars". That is what the car should be & have a STOCK turbo, not a cheater turbo.
 
Dennis Kirban called me about this exact subject not long before the Nats. I would gladly look at putting this class together. Work out the details and let me know what ya'll want to do and we will see if we can make it happen. As of right now the only class that I know of that is getting revamped is the Hybrid class that I created. The two will be condensed into one and it will now be much more relaxed and set up using a bracket style dial in but on a .500 pro tree. Let me know about the stock appearing turbo class.

Jim C. - GSCA Race Director
 
IMHO, there doesn't need to be an all stock heads-up class. There needs to be a mid-low 11-sec. class for the majority of the cars that are out there. Limit it to a max. 59mm inducer, 8" tires maybe, and go from there.

Just my .02...


K.
 
Dennis Kirban called me about this exact subject not long before the Nats. I would gladly look at putting this class together. Work out the details and let me know what ya'll want to do and we will see if we can make it happen. As of right now the only class that I know of that is getting revamped is the Hybrid class that I created. The two will be condensed into one and it will now be much more relaxed and set up using a bracket style dial in but on a .500 pro tree. Let me know about the stock appearing turbo class.

Jim C. - GSCA Race Director

Thanks for your help Jim!

My thoughts on this class would be all the major components remain stock with the cork in the system being a true STOCK turbo. Intercooler, manifolds, air cleaner, downpipe & elbow, MAF, ECM, block & heads, etc... all original.

Stock suspension with sway bars in place running on drag radials.

Closed exhaust

Any other ideas?
 
Stock turbo, stock intercooler

Run what you brung and hope you brung enough
 
I would think that actually enforcing an absolutely stock turbo would be tough to due. As mentioned before what about stock appearing turbo with the stock elbow and factory DP? Stock intercooler as mentioned by Jay. Limit the injector size to 42.5-lbs and then limit the tire size and make it a drag radial class to boot? What about having to run a full exhaust by not allowing the usage of cutouts? Not trying to step on anyones toes just tossing ideas out as fruit for thought......................

Jim C. - GSCA Race Director
 
One could really be a sh*t and emulate the rules of the F.A.S.T series and leave them on radial tires to boot. Wouldn't that be like driving a wet bar of soap??? :eek:

Jim C.
 
Checking turbo size isnt that difficult.. you can just use a plug to check the inlet size. The turbine side may be a little tougher but a small compresser wheel would negate any gains on the turbine side for the most part.

Limiting injector size, etc is kind of hokey. If you got enough motor to make the power, you should be able to do it.

Truthfully, Nick's TFS rules are about perfect if some of the gray areas are fleshed out. Im probably biased since we actually built a car around that class but I didnt find them to be overly stifling. You still had a good amount of creative freedom under those rules.
 
I would think that actually enforcing an absolutely stock turbo would be tough to due. As mentioned before what about stock appearing turbo with the stock elbow and factory DP? Stock intercooler as mentioned by Jay. Limit the injector size to 42.5-lbs and then limit the tire size and make it a drag radial class to boot? What about having to run a full exhaust by not allowing the usage of cutouts? Not trying to step on anyones toes just tossing ideas out as fruit for thought......................

Jim C. - GSCA Race Director

Jim, limiting it to a "stock appearing" turbo would be leaving out 99% of the cars you're trying to entice. The Te-series turbos outsell the Ta-series 10 to none anymore. That's why we changed that rule in TSS. Let the Te-sries guys/gals play to, but limit it in size. (59mm)

Stock intercooler is a fine rule as well. But would you need it if you limit the turbo?

Why limit the injector size? I don't think it will make a difference at the performance levels we're talking about.

Definitely full exhaust, and drag radials would be cool.

The ability to police stroker motors, and actually do it!!! :eek:


K.
 
How about these as a starting point. They are a modified version on the TSS rules and do address the issue of the TA vs. TE turbo size. Thoughts and/or input?

Factory Stock Appearing – FSA

General

Heads-up 4-tenths pro tree start and pro ladder. (1 vs 16, 2 vs 15, 3 vs 14, 4 vs 13, 5 vs 12, etc....)
All cars racing in the Turbo Heads-Up racing classes must be owned and driven by a current member of the GSCA.
No peer technical inspections relating to safety equipment rules by class participants or peers, Beech Bend Raceway track safety technician personnel will make all rulings on track safety related items.
Winner and runner-up are subject to re-weigh and re-tech immediately after final round or at any other time.
Any entrant caught trying to deliberately break the rules will be disqualified from the TSS class.
To compete in this class the car must be Factory Stock Appearing with the following exceptions and/or clarifications:
Definition of "Factory Stock Appearing"
A factory stock appearing part is a GM part originally delivered on a 1986 to 1987 Buick Regal, GNX, Grand National, T-Type or Turbo Regal from Buick Motor Division and is externally stock in appearance. No external welding, cold weld epoxy, puttying, etc. may be done on any factory stock appearing part unless specifically stated. See Engine section for cylinder block requirements. * Note: GM exhaust headers may be welded on externally to repair defects. This includes the driver's side header area that is prone to cracking and may include welding on both driver and passenger side header between the primary port and mounting flange. Welded in EGT gauge probe bungs are allowed. See Engine and Engine Management section for cylinder block and ignition requirements.

Chassis

Seat belts, lights, horn, and windshield wipers must be operational.
All factory headlights must be in place during competition.
Helmet required. Cars must pass track safety inspection.
Car should possess all applicable safety equipment for potential ET/speeds attained.
Minimum car weight w/driver must be at least 3,500 pounds.
Complete stock, painted TR/GN body required.
No fiberglass or carbon fiber body parts, bumpers or hood scoops.
Stock operating glass windows and windshield required, no lexan.
Engine/firewall must be in stock location.
Stock wheelbase required (108.0" measured).
Factory stock appearing inner front wheel wells required.
Factory stock appearing front suspension components and mounting locations required w/any type stock location shocks. Swaybars may be removed.
Factory stock rear suspension locations required with any type stock location shocks.


**All control arms must use the factory mounting location. No bolt-in or welded relocators allowed. (ie. Southside bars).**

No quarter panel modifications except rolled inner fender lip.
Minor modifications to stock rear wheel wells (no mini-tubs).
Outer frame rail notching is allowed. Inner frame rails remain stock. No inner frame rail reinforcement allowed.
No ladder bars or coil over equipped rear suspension.
No wheelie bars or parachutes.
Brake system must be either Power Master or vacuum boost operated, no manual brakes allowed.
Brake system line locks allowed.
Drive shaft safety loop required.
Driver's name and club decal on side/quarter windows allowed. Sponsor/vendor decal is acceptable on the rear window.
A maximum of 2 hood mounted gauges are allowed.

Engine

Buick V6 block < 240CID max.

**Block casting number 25526109 only. No Stage or A/M blocks!!**

Must use DIS type I or II ignition, NO distributor.
8-bolt Iron cylinder head castings required. No Stage 2 or aluminum heads.
Factory valve covers and oil pan required.
No dry sump-oiling system.
Factory stock intake manifold required. No external welding allowed * No modifications such as welding, cold weld epoxy, putty, etc. may be done on any portion of the intake manifold runners to increase manifold air flow are allowed.
Factory stock appearing cast aluminum intake plenum allowed.
Factory stock appearing throttle body required. * Throttle body may be bored to 62-mm so long as it retains the factory stock appearance.
Factory stock appearing driver's side exhaust headers. No ATR, Hooker, Terry Houston or Poston replacements allowed.
Factory crossover pipe required. No delta gates allowed.
Any single or dual exhaust system allowed. Must muffle and exit in stock location(s) (3.0" max size). * Exhaust must run through mufflers in competition.
Factory downpipe elbow and downpipe from the turbo is required. It must be routed down through the stock location. No flex pipe allowed.

Turbo

**One (1) factory stock appearing TA series, Garrett 3-bolt turbo required. Maximum 60.00-mm compressor wheel, Inlet bore maximum 60.50-mm measured. No ported shroud compressor housing. The TA series turbo compressor inlet housing must be a 3" inlet with a 2" outlet only.
No ball bearing turbos of any type.


Intercooler

Factory stock location air to air intercooler required, no modifications allowed.
No front mount intercoolers are allowed.
No liquid intercoolers, intercooler external spray cooling, or add-on cold boxes allowed.

Engine Management & Fuel System

Stock ECM or modified stock ECM only. NO aftermarket fuel system systems allowed, (DFI, FAST, Motec, etc). NO speed density sysytems.
Factory Stock Appearing (Type I) or (Type II) DIS cam position sensor required.
No individual coil per spark plug ignitions allowed.
No distributor ignitions allowed.
No delay boxes, throttle stops, or crossover boxes allowed.
Any intake air induction system allowed.
Factory MAF sensor is required. All intake air must pass through and be measured by the MAF sensor.
Any fuel pump(s) allowed. * Note: Fuel pump(s) must not be visible from outside of car.
Voltage increasing and fuel pump hot wiring devices are allowed.
All factory stock appearing fuel lines required.
Factory stock appearing fuel rail required.
Any type fuel pressure regulator allowed.
Up to 60-lb fuel injectors allowed, 6 maximum.
Factory stock appearing fuel tank required with no additional cells or sumps.
Gasoline fuel only, no additives, alcohol, or nitrous oxide injection allowed.

Engine Compartment

Air conditioning operational w/belt in stock location.
Power steering operational w/belt in stock location.
Stock alternator operational w/belt in stock location.
Stock water pump operational w/belt in stock location.
No engine compartment dress up is allowed with the exception of chromed or polished factory parts.
Battery, one (1) only and it must be the stock location.
Stock type electric engine cooling fan required.
Any stock or replacement radiator in stock location allowed.

Transmission

GM 200-4R transmission required.
Any size torque converter acceptable, with or without lock-up.
Any transmission oil cooler and pan allowed.
No transmission brake allowed.

Differential

Factory stock appearing differential housing required.
No differential spools.
Any gear ratio w/factory stock or reinforced differential cover allowed.
Tires & Wheels

Drag radials up to 275/60-15 are allowed. Tires may not be shaved.
Front tire footprint must be at least 5.0" wide.

Interior

Full stock interior required.
Stock transmission shifter required.
No external aftermarket gauges allowed. Internal gauges such as boost, oil pressure and water temp are allowed. Knock sensor and scan masters are allowed.

Jim C. - GSCA Race Director
 
I think there needs to be a couple of new classes. Either stock turbo and I/C or like Keith suggested a limit of a 59mm wheel. I would also like to see a class for the 60-66mm guys. You have TSS up to 67 then TSM at 70. Limit the turbo and I/C and all the rest will fall into place IMO! Run what you brung:biggrin:
 
I think there needs to be a couple of new classes. Either stock turbo and I/C or like Keith suggested a limit of a 59mm wheel. I would also like to see a class for the 60-66mm guys. You have TSS up to 67 then TSM at 70. Limit the turbo and I/C and all the rest will fall into place IMO! Run what you brung:biggrin:

I agree, Limit the turbo & intercooler and the rest will fall into place.
 
I agree, Limit the turbo & intercooler and the rest will fall into place.

OK, so where do we draw the line on turbo size (59-mm as suggested)? Stock intercooler? Do we allow the Dutt. neck mod? I am all for getting ya'll this class up and running. What say ya'll?

Jim C. - GSCA Race Director
 
Sounds great Jim, I will help anyway I can!
 
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