Video-Turbo Ford SHO's Side-by-Side Racing

[TurboJunky]

Re: Re: Funny

Originally posted by UNGN
A "laptop tuner" doesn't really mean much. My Stock GN has a laptop in the passenger seat so I can see what my temps are and what my RPM is and how much boost I'm running over 14 psi (stock gages are non-existant or can't be trusted as far as you can throw them).

It LOOKS like I'm a big time FI tuner, but I'm just want to see what the car is idling at, whether the O2 sensor is still working etc.

If the TTA had a FAST or the fuel map was actually being TUNED by a laptop, a SHO wouldn't stand a chance. Period.

A STOCK Turbo/injector/intercooler TTA will run 114 in the 1/4. $2-3K in bolt on mods (turbo, injectors, intercooler, misc) will run OVER 120 in the 1/4.

Quite right. The new owner of my old TTA is now running a best of 11.7x at over 120mph with tires, chip, turbo, FPR and FP. Not bad for under $2k in mods...

 

[brandon87gta]

I am very confident that I will reach that goal this year. Now, if you were talking strictly about a 1/4 drag race, then yes, that 114 TTA would beat me or the S/C'd cars ( I am assuming with that trap he would be running ver low 12's).

At a 114MPH trap speed, a TTA would easily be in the high 11's

Brandon

 

[UNGN]

Originally posted by Toolman
Those are very nice times, but if you are saying that a SHO would not stand a chance against the above TTA, that is simply not the case.

Maybe you misunderstood what I was saying. A TTA can be made to EASILY run mid 120's in the 1/4 using the Stock computer with a chip and injectors. No "laptop tuning" required.

The laptop was probably running turbolink or direct scan which are relatively inexpensive scan tool software. Thousands of Buick/TTA have them. They tell you your temps and RPM's and the like, but they are in NO WAY controlling the car.

Big Difference.

The TTA you raced could have been 100% stock. The laptop doesn't mean anything.

 

[SHOMurph]

Sorry this turned into a flame fest. It was just suppose to be an explanation of about our cars and to answer any questions. Alot of people don't know them and are quick to judge without checking them out. Thats what makes them great sleepers.

The Red SC SHO did race and beat the Turbo TA from a dead stop about 3 or 4 times. The Turbo TA also had 56k on the clock and is cherry. I was behind them trying to keep up.

Thats not to say our cars will beat you guys. Thats just what happened that day. We're not calling you guys out in anyway.

In fact I admire the GNs and GNXs. They are awesome brutally quick cars. I hope to own one someday.

But its ok. Nobody gives a SHO respect. I'm use to it.

Murph

 

[myclone]

Originally posted by SHOMurph
But its ok. Nobody gives a SHO respect. I'm use to it.

Murph

I hear ya on the no respect thing.... SyTy's dont get any either

Dont worry about the cranky ppl either. As was mentioned it happens around here bout every winter for as long as I can recall.

SHO's arent really my style in the looks dept but a coworker has one for a driver (VERY minor/free mods) and it seems to run pretty decent when the RPMs start climbing. Unknowing ppl or ricers seem to be his favorite victoms . Im still trying to get him to throw some boost at it but so far he's resisted all my prodding.

 

[Toolman]

Originally posted by UNGN
Maybe you misunderstood what I was saying. A TTA can be made to EASILY run mid 120's in the 1/4 using the Stock computer with a chip and injectors. No "laptop tuning" required.

While I do not doubt what turbo TA's are capable of, from what I have read on this site, it might be overeaching to say one can be made EASILY to run mid 120 traps. Perhaps our definitions differ, but I found details on a good number of TTA's with a number of modifications, all running very respectable times (mid 11's), but most were in the 114-118 mph traps. The one I did see running 124mph traps had what I consider extensive mods and pretty stout boost (28psi, certainly more than you would run every day on the street). Perhaps if it is so easy, you might let these guys in on the secret, because they may be going about the wrong way.

And most of the stock times I saw were in the low to mid 13's, many times just a tad over 100mph. Don't take this wrong, not doubting, just wanting clarification, but are you saying that you can gain 14mph in the 1/4 and drop over 1.5 seconds simply by tuning it on a laptop?

Originally posted by UNGNIf the TTA had a FAST or the fuel map was actually being TUNED by a laptop, a SHO wouldn't stand a chance. Period.

A STOCK Turbo/injector/intercooler TTA will run 114 in the 1/4.

Originally posted by brandon87gtaAt a 114MPH trap speed, a TTA would easily be in the high 11's

BTW, it was not me who raced the TTA, but were he 100% stock, it seems the s/c'd SHO would have no problem getting a win, especially from a roll. Obviously, mod for mod, a TTA is going to walk all over a SHO. And it is plain that the potential of the TTA is worlds beyond that of a SHO ( I plan on hitting 120 traps this year, but have no chance of ever breaking into the 10's like 120mph trapping TTA's. low 12's will probably be the best a SHO EVER sees).

That said, please understand that no one is here trying to claim SHO superiority. But there is also no reason to doubt what the video showed. A 400whp SHO hanging with and walking a very capable Corvette and Lightning. That is all I am trying to say. You guys are very proud of your vehicles, and rightly so. But please do not be so quick to discredit any other form of transportation, simply because it does not meet your standard of what a fast car should be. It seems you would easily recognize what a properly sized turbo can do for relatively small displacement engines, since that is what GN's and TTA's are all about.

That is all I have to say on the subject. I hope the next time that a SHO comes up in conversation here (if that ever happens), that we can all get along as fellow auto enthusiasts.

 

[blue92]

Toolman

Tim I don't think that TA was a totally stock TA it belongs to Sergio.


I like and respect any car enthusiast that enjoys building and saving any great American cars. Props to all on that note.

 

[teranfon]

Interesting thread.

Personally I've owned two SHO's. A 1989 and 1992. Both cars purchased new and both were very enjoyable and well built. Both were very quick on the top end. With modifications I don't doubt their enhanced top-end performance.

Always amazes me how some members on this board are so quick to dispute the performance outside the relm of turbo regals. As much as I love TB's, I hardly think they're the nirvana of the automotive world.

Welcome to the board SHO guys. I'm the original owner of a 1986 Grand National that spends most of its life in the garage, but have always found SHO's interesting and admire them.

 

[SyHopeful]

Originally posted by teranfon
Always amazes me how some members on this board are so quick to dispute the performance outside the relm of turbo regals. As much as I love TB's, I hardly think they're the nirvana of the automotive world.

Holy ****, I'm not alone!

 

[UNGN]

Originally posted by Toolman
While I do not doubt what turbo TA's are capable of, from what I have read on this site, it might be overeaching to say one can be made EASILY to run mid 120 traps. Perhaps our definitions differ, but I found details on a good number of TTA's with a number of modifications, all running very respectable times (mid 11's), but most were in the 114-118 mph traps. The one I did see running 124mph traps had what I consider extensive mods and pretty stout boost (28psi, certainly more than you would run every day on the street). Perhaps if it is so easy, you might let these guys in on the secret, because they may be going about the wrong way.

My T-type ran 11.53@118.3 with a $400 turbo, $200 Injectors, $25 Chip, a $120 intercooler mod and a $200 downpipe... on BFG Drag Radials at a reasonable 23 lbs of boost.

A TTA would be good for 2-3 mph more with the same mods. With the stock sized tire (245/50VR16) the car won't go much faster than 115-116 in drive because it runs out of RPM (5200 RPM). Put 26, 27 or 28" tires on the back and there is nothing artificially holding it back in the 1/4.

On 93 octane gas and 17 psi of boost it would be no where near this fast, but racing a TTA/TR without octane is stupid. What can I say.

Originally posted by Toolman

And most of the stock times I saw were in the low to mid 13's, many times just a tad over 100mph. Don't take this wrong, not doubting, just wanting clarification, but are you saying that you can gain 14mph in the 1/4 and drop over 1.5 seconds simply by tuning it on a laptop?

No I'm saying the Laptop DOESN'T mean the car was modified in any way. The computer is a SCAN TOOL. It doesn't do the tuning. The owner has to do all the tuning. manually, with his hands, under the hood. What I'm saying is when you see a laptop in a TR or TTA it doesn't mean the car is fast.

My stock GN has a laptop in the passenger seat. It will run 13's@103 (stock boost, stock tires, stock almost everything except gutted cat, Exhaust and K&N)

If I were to add a $25 chip, 3-5 gallons of 110-116 octane gas, raise the boost to 21 psi and put on a set of 275/60 BFGDR's it will run low 12's @ 110-112 mph. This is with the stock turbo, intercooler, injectors, trans, rear, wheels, motor, body, suspension, etc.

If a car has FAST or Felpro or DFI then the computer is doing the tuning. You won't see this on cars running slower than mid 120's in the 1/4 because it's not necessary.

 

[RoadRageGN]

ToolMan you will have to excuse most of these guys.. when ya get up in age ya get more cranky..

Time to step up the gerital guys.. those cars are fast.. plain and simple.

 

[Little6pack]

Originally posted by RoadRageGN
ToolMan you will have to excuse most of these guys.. when ya get up in age ya get more cranky..

Time to step up the gerital guys.. those cars are fast.. plain and simple.

-----------------------------------------
We older guys maybe cranky But you young guys have less brains
-----------------------------------------

Tool Man I understand your love for cars as we all do.

I don't dislike a SLEEPER or a 4 door car that can really haul.
in fact I think it is kind of cool. we are not as narrow minded
as some think. Coming here & shoving this & that is not the way to make friends.

(maybe if you SHO guys came in with a little respect for us,
some of us might understand) maybe I was too quick to jump on the ford thing because I disliked the VID.
To me the vid was a waste of time to watch especially here.
(that is another subject) I thought it might have shown
a GN & SHO.

Ok so your cars can do warp speed so lets leave it at that.
You keep preaching to the GN guys & getting nowhere.

SYHOPEFUL as the AOL mail theme says " You have friend" in canada.
maybe you two should get together.

 

[SyHopeful]

Originally posted by littlesixsteve
(maybe if you SHO guys came in with a little respect for us,
some of us might understand)

Jesus Christ man, are you blind? Did you have some trained monkey read this thread to you in a series of grunts and yells? The SHO guys have been NOTHING if not respectful!! How many times have they said they love turbo Buicks and think they are great cars?

SYHOPEFUL as the AOL mail theme says " You have friend" in canada.
maybe you two should get together.

I just might. At least the guy knows what "reading comprehension" is

 

[Little6pack]

Originally posted by SyHopeful
they said they love turbo Buicks and think they are great cars?

Hard to know if they are great cars when they don't own any GN's.

That is like me saying the SHO is a great car & never drive, ride or own one.

 

[Toolman]

Originally posted by UNGN
My T-type ran 11.53@118.3 with a $400 turbo, $200 Injectors, $25 Chip, a $120 intercooler mod and a $200 downpipe... on BFG Drag Radials at a reasonable 23 lbs of boost.

On 93 octane gas and 17 psi of boost it would be no where near this fast, but racing a TTA/TR without octane is stupid. What can I say.

I guess part of me likes the streetable aspect of my car @ 12 psi and on pump gas. IMO 430whp at that trim is very acceptable. So can we agree that if this particular TTA that the SHO ran was on pump gas and closer to stock boost pressure that the race could go either way?

No I'm saying the Laptop DOESN'T mean the car was modified in any way. The computer is a SCAN TOOL. It doesn't do the tuning. The owner has to do all the tuning. manually, with his hands, under the hood. What I'm saying is when you see a laptop in a TR or TTA it doesn't mean the car is fast.

My stock GN has a laptop in the passenger seat. It will run 13's@103 (stock boost, stock tires, stock almost everything except gutted cat, Exhaust and K&N)

If I were to add a $25 chip, 3-5 gallons of 110-116 octane gas, raise the boost to 21 psi and put on a set of 275/60 BFGDR's it will run low 12's @ 110-112 mph. This is with the stock turbo, intercooler, injectors, trans, rear, wheels, motor, body, suspension, etc.

If a car has FAST or Felpro or DFI then the computer is doing the tuning. You won't see this on cars running slower than mid 120's in the 1/4 because it's not necessary.

Thank you for the clarification.

 

[Toolman]

Originally posted by RoadRageGN
ToolMan you will have to excuse most of these guys.. when ya get up in age ya get more cranky..

Time to step up the gerital guys.. those cars are fast.. plain and simple.

NP RoagRageGN, and thanks for the props.

 

[UNGN]

Originally posted by Toolman
I guess part of me likes the streetable aspect of my car @ 12 psi and on pump gas. IMO 430whp at that trim is very acceptable. So can we agree that if this particular TTA that the SHO ran was on pump gas and closer to stock boost pressure that the race could go either way?

If he was running pump gas, you should have killed him.

He would have been a dumbass for trying to run straight 93 however. Race gas is by far the cheapest mod you can do to a TR/TTA. Not only will it net 1 second/10 mph in the 1/4 mile, it will keep the car from damaging itself.

You have to realize our heads only flow 155-160 CFM on the intake and 125 or so exhaust... it takes a lot of boost to make HP.

 

[Toolman]

Well, I said earlier that that was all I had to say, but please let me repond once more (maybe twice )

Originally posted by littlesixsteve

Tool Man I understand your love for cars as we all do.

I don't dislike a SLEEPER or a 4 door car that can really haul.
in fact I think it is kind of cool. we are not as narrow minded
as some think. Coming here & shoving this & that is not the way to make friends.

(maybe if you SHO guys came in with a little respect for us,
some of us might understand)

Since you prefaced your comments with my name, I am desirous to ask you to please quote anything I have stated on this site that you find disrespectful toward turbo Buicks or the members here. I also am seeing a lack of anything that could be considered 'shoving this & that'.

maybe I was too quick to jump on the ford thing because I disliked the VID.
To me the vid was a waste of time to watch especially here.
(that is another subject) I thought it might have shown
a GN & SHO.

I can not control who posts my vid where. From what I can see, it was one of your own members, not any SHO people. I only posted it on sites relevant to the cars involved (LS1.com, SVT boards and the SHO board). I in no way intended it to show itself on a GN board. I can not see how you can fault me or the SHO community for this vid appearing here.

Ok so your cars can do warp speed so lets leave it at that.
You keep preaching to the GN guys & getting nowhere.

Again, what was I preaching save for the fact that TB's are much more capable machines with much better 1/4 mile times? The only points I was attempting to make concerned my particular vehicle vs the vehicles in the vid, since members were doubting the honesty of the vid. Telling someone that they misrepresented their car or those of others to try and make the outcome of a race appear different from reality is akin to calling their honesty into question, even if it is only on an internet forum. And I feel I have every right to defend my honesty, for it is something I value highly. That said, there is no use beating a dead horse, and obviously I will never convince some concerning the facts about my choice of vehicle, but as they say, diversity is the spice of life (they do say that don't they?). Take care gentlemen.

 

[RoadRageGN]

Originally posted by Toolman
RoagRageGN

doh

 

[RossGN]

Cool vid and cool thread. This is the "Lounge", so the topic is fine. I've owned GNs, a ZR-1, SHOs, and an '03 Cobra. All do certain things better than the other (ever try to strap a baby seat in the trunk of a vette )

I've been a member of this board since '98 (lost post count when the board went down a few years ago), and have to say I'm a little disappointed is some of the member's response to this thread. I guess all boards have some sour apples