What are the cons of Aluminum heads on a street car?

[TURBOPOWERED68]

Fully ported and polished heads will help. Your 206 cam will work but I do think a bigger cam, 212/218 will help. If you are running E85 you will have to pay close attention to correct fueling to make that much power.

There are advantages to running aluminum heads as has been stated, there were guys running 9.90s in 20 years ago using a 60-1 turbo. So it's all very much about your combo. If you are using the stock intercooler in your sig, port and polish the irons and save the money for a good intercooler.

Front mount is coming real soon

I figure since my car is so damn heavy I have to make more power than most to go just as fast.
Theres a guy upgrading to aluminum heads this winter hopefully I can afford to buy his heads. (Hint James hint)

At the price of $4k I would never do it.

 

[kidglok]

Front mount is coming real soon

I figure since my car is so damn heavy I have to make more power than most to go just as fast.
Theres a guy upgrading to aluminum heads this winter hopefully I can afford to buy his heads. (Hint James hint)

At the price of $4k I would never do it.

My heads won't do you much good unless your running a cam that needs the springs they are set up for. An off the shelf set of irons will be cheaper and easier to set up for you.

What bison does to the heads to accommodate the new springs is where his service comes in.


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[turbojoe1]

Great thread here

 

[TTipe]

My heads won't do you much good unless your running a cam that needs the springs they are set up for. An off the shelf set of irons will be cheaper and easier to set up for you.

What bison does to the heads to accommodate the new springs is where his service comes in.


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My friends unported GN1's (which I talked him into) move his car around better (by the butt dyno at this time) than his Champ ported irons did. He had a more aggressive cam (212/206;111) 1.5RR with the irons. His GN1's work with a (206/206;110 billet) 1.5RR. There may be something to be said for bigger unshrouded valves.

 

[kidglok]

My friends unported GN1's (which I talked him into) move his car around better (by the butt dyno at this time) than his Champ ported irons did. He had a more aggressive cam (212/206;111) 1.5RR with the irons. His GN1's work with a (206/206;110 billet) 1.5RR. There may be something to be said for bigger unshrouded valves.

The billet cams are usually more aggressive, so calling it milder based on the advertised lift at .050 isn't necessarily an accurate description of the cams behavior.


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[TTipe]

The billet cams are usually more aggressive, so calling it milder based on the advertised lift at .050 isn't necessarily an accurate description of the cams behavior.


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I beg to differ with you. Billet cams exist due to the possibility of high pressure (500 lb+) on the nose of the cam and the fact that the performance endurance limit of billet is infinite, iron is finite, but austentemper is better finite. In the prior configuration (austentemper) I very much doubt that you will see any deflection from about 400 + lb (austentemper, which is good to 500lb +) on the nose. This motor used K 750's at 0.496/0.496. I can let you know whether ported GN1's feel like $4k worth. Just looking into the intake manifold at sewer mains makes me think I could sell tickets

 

[kidglok]

I beg to differ with you. Billet cams exist due to the possibility of high pressure (500 lb+) on the nose of the cam and the fact that the performance endurance limit of billet is infinite, iron is finite, but austentemper is better finite. In the prior configuration (austentemper) I very much doubt that you will see any deflection from about 400 + lb (austentemper, which is good to 500lb +) on the nose. This motor used K 750's at 0.496/0.496. I can let you know whether ported GN1's feel like $4k worth. Just looking into the intake manifold at sewer mains makes me think I could sell tickets

I doubt the same grinds can be had from a regular iron blank, if that was the case there would be no need for a billet.


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[TTipe]

I doubt the same grinds can be had from a regular iron blank, if that was the case there would be no need for a billet.


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I thought this discussion dealt with Aluminum vs Irons in street applications.

 

[kidglok]

I thought this discussion dealt with Aluminum vs Irons in street applications.

It is, I just explained why my heads wouldn't be necessary for Dave and a set of regular irons would lol someone named ttipe started the cam discussion lol


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[TURBOPOWERED68]

The billet cams are usually more aggressive, so calling it milder based on the advertised lift at .050 isn't necessarily an accurate description of the cams behavior.


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No begging
But i would go for a cam swap if it would produce a gain.

 

[2QUICK2B6]

I have close to or over 4k in a set of chapion non r heads including the the T&D rockers for the 14 blt heads ... it can get exspensive quick

 

[TURBOPOWERED68]

I have close to or over 4k in a set of chapion non r heads including the the T&D rockers for the 14 blt heads ... it can get exspensive quick

aluminum or iron?

 

[TURBOPOWERED68]

Aluminum $1,695.00 Complete Set
These come with valves already installed is that correct?
How do you double the price with rockers and springs?

Iron Heads $1,195.00 Outright Price. No Exchange!
I have a price quote including a ported intake manifold $2,517.86 shipped
GN1 Iron K-750 Hydraulic Roller Upgrade Kit
ARP 123-4203 Buick Grand National Iron Head Stud Kit
12 pt Pro Series for Stock Block
Cometic Gasket C5691-040 - I am not using cometics but are in the quote.
FELMS96033 Buick V6 Standard Intake Gasket
Buick V-6 Ported Stock Intake Manifold (Labor
W/Exchange Core)
Buick Production V6 13/16 shaft Int 1.65 Exh 1.65

 

[kidglok]

Aluminum $1,695.00 Complete Set
These come with valves already installed is that correct?
How do you double the price with rockers and springs?

Iron Heads $1,195.00 Outright Price. No Exchange!
I have a price quote including a ported intake manifold $2,517.86 shipped
GN1 Iron K-750 Hydraulic Roller Upgrade Kit
ARP 123-4203 Buick Grand National Iron Head Stud Kit
12 pt Pro Series for Stock Block
Cometic Gasket C5691-040 - I am not using cometics but are in the quote.
FELMS96033 Buick V6 Standard Intake Gasket
Buick V-6 Ported Stock Intake Manifold (Labor
W/Exchange Core)
Buick Production V6 13/16 shaft Int 1.65 Exh 1.65

He is taking about Jessel style rockers on aluminum heads.
Heads $1695
Porting $700
Rocker shafts $1000
Springs $200
Then you have machine work to cut the guides to accept certain springs. Figure $200
Titanium retainers/locks. $350

Just using rough numbers.



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[pacecarta]

you forgot the machine work to mill the pedastils for jesel setup and custom cut taller valves for the jesel James

 

[TURBOPOWERED68]

He is taking about Jessel style rockers on aluminum heads.
Heads $1695
Porting $700
Rocker shafts $1000
Springs $200
Then you have machine work to cut the guides to accept certain springs. Figure $200
Titanium retainers/locks. $350

Just using rough numbers.

Jessel set is unbreakable. I get that.
Vs
T&D break how often? Cost ??
Vs
HS break how often? Cost me $550.00





Rememver guys I am just trying to learn not challenge any one or know better.
Thanks for you help

 

[kidglok]

you forgot the machine work to mill the pedastils for jesel setup and custom cut taller valves for the jesel James

Jessel set is unbreakable. I get that.
Vs
T&D break how often? Cost ??
Vs
HS break how often? Cost me $550.00

I forgot about that Paul. When you buy a set of "8 bolt" aluminums they are set up for stock style rocker shafts. I personally don't trust this setup with higher spring pressures since I have seen the rocker stands break off on aluminum heads. I think tom charged me $120 to mill the stands off and drill them for jessel rockers.

8 bolt Gn1's still have the outter bolt holes like the 14 bolt does, but the inner head bolts are not drilled and they have stock style rocker stands


The 14 bolt GN1's are set up for all 14 bolts drilled and the Jessel style rocker setup.


David to answer your question I don't think it's the rockers themselves that break, but more so the stands they are bolted to. Also running the taller valves opens up the spring choice which is the main reason for doing it. I think the valves are about $35-40 a piece, and Tom had to cut them down because they don't make the proper height "off the shelf".


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[bison]

He is taking about Jessel style rockers on aluminum heads.
Heads $1695
Porting $700
Rocker shafts $1000
Springs $200
Then you have machine work to cut the guides to accept certain springs. Figure $200
Titanium retainers/locks. $350

Just using rough numbers.



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^^^this


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[bison]

He is taking about Jessel style rockers on aluminum heads.
Heads $1695
Porting $700
Rocker shafts $1000
Springs $200
Then you have machine work to cut the guides to accept certain springs. Figure $200
Titanium retainers/locks. $350

Just using rough numbers.



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^^^this


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[pacecarta]

besdes the jesels look so cool they should sell see through valve covers for them