What Do I Need To Convert To Vacuum Brake's???

[bmackinnon]

No one has mentioned the vacuum block, where the vacuum signal is sourced. You'll need the turbo Trans Am block, listed as the vacuum conversion block. $45 at gbodyparts.com, but most of the other vendors sell them as well. The turbo TA's came with the vacuum set up from the factory, so that's good enough for me. Good luck.

BS! $45??? Totally unnecessary. 'T' into the PVC line with a (overpriced) $.99 plastic T, and run the vac hose from there behind the coil pack to the booster. The vac comes from the same place.... $45 vac block to move the connection source 2"????? Whatever.....

 

[cruzn57]

I run

im no expert but i've heard vacum brakes wont hold well building boost at the line. has anyone added a vacum pump to compensate for that?

11.00 @130 no T brake, and have no problem holding at the line,
anything over 8lbs blows the tires away ( slicks)
when your car idles, it builds vacumn in the brake resesvior, it takes 3-4 application to deplete the vacumn, WITH THE ENGINE OFF,
no I haven't heard of anyone using a vac pump, I'm sure there are some who have used one.,
no need in my case,

 

[ReaL99]

To convert to vacuum brake's a shop said that for all the parts it would be $300 and for the labor $300.Total $600 to convert to vacuum brakes.Also a new Powermaster unit $650 plus $170 for labor=$820. I thought the conversion to going to vacuum brake's would save me more.If I did it my self it would, but Im not going to tackle it.

 

[BLACK6PACK]

Its not a hard job and you'll appreciate it more once its done. Like was said before, get everything of Red Regal, spend an hour putting it in and save $500. If you get stuck, come on the board and ask a question.

 

[BlackBandit]

To convert to vacuum brake's a shop said that for all the parts it would be $300 and for the labor $300.Total $600 to convert to vacuum brakes.Also a new Powermaster unit $650 plus $170 for labor=$820. I thought the conversion to going to vacuum brake's would save me more.If I did it my self it would, but Im not going to tackle it.

It will save you more if you go to a shop that doesn't rip you off. The first time I did the conversion it took about 45 minutes to an hour start to finish. I took my time, drank beer, checked everything. Now, I'm fairly handy around a car, but any shop should be handy as well. By my math that means the shop is charging you $300 an hour. In my book that's a rip off and I would look for a new shop. Since you insist on buying parts new I won't tackle that cost issue. I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing. If you do go to this shop think of this. When it's done you won't have to buy anymore Powermaster parts. If anything fails it'll only cost $20-$50 to fix instead of hundreds, and you'd be able to get the parts no matter where you're at. Speaking of where you're at, where are you at? Maybe there's someone close that would assist you with the swap and you could meet some TB guys andsave money. Now that would be a sweet deal!

 

[ReaL99]

It will save you more if you go to a shop that doesn't rip you off. The first time I did the conversion it took about 45 minutes to an hour start to finish. I took my time, drank beer, checked everything. Now, I'm fairly handy around a car, but any shop should be handy as well. By my math that means the shop is charging you $300 an hour. In my book that's a rip off and I would look for a new shop. Since you insist on buying parts new I won't tackle that cost issue. I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing. If you do go to this shop think of this. When it's done you won't have to buy anymore Powermaster parts. If anything fails it'll only cost $20-$50 to fix instead of hundreds, and you'd be able to get the parts no matter where you're at. Speaking of where you're at, where are you at? Maybe there's someone close that would assist you with the swap and you could meet some TB guys andsave money. Now that would be a sweet deal!

Im in PA. about 10 miles from Maplegrove Raceway.The problem is that if I do it alone I risk doing something I really don't know anything about.I don't know if I would trust the car after trying to do the conversion.Im only handy with some things but I never have done brake's or anything relating to them before.

 

[GSTOY]

I'm going to do this, this weekend. My PM gve up the seal in the pump, and I'm not going to toss 1 more dollar at the PM system.

Steve

 

[bmackinnon]

It will save you more if you go to a shop that doesn't rip you off. The first time I did the conversion it took about 45 minutes to an hour start to finish. I took my time, drank beer, checked everything. Now, I'm fairly handy around a car, but any shop should be handy as well. By my math that means the shop is charging you $300 an hour. In my book that's a rip off and I would look for a new shop. Since you insist on buying parts new I won't tackle that cost issue. I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing. If you do go to this shop think of this. When it's done you won't have to buy anymore Powermaster parts. If anything fails it'll only cost $20-$50 to fix instead of hundreds, and you'd be able to get the parts no matter where you're at. Speaking of where you're at, where are you at? Maybe there's someone close that would assist you with the swap and you could meet some TB guys andsave money. Now that would be a sweet deal!

Bravo!! Well said....

 

[bmackinnon]

Couple pics

Here's a few pics of mine, fyi... 'T'd hoses replacing stock molded PCV hose; routed behind coil pack; over to the booster (check valve is integral to the booster supply port), installed view from other side...

 

[turbofish38]

I don't see where you guys are coming up with 45-60 minutes for the install. I pull these out of the boneyards all of the time so I could probably do the swap blindfolded with one hand tied behind my back and I'd say this is at least a 3 hour job from start to finish on a first time install. Don't forget you have to bleed the brake system. Heck it takes me at least 15 minutes just to pull the vacuum set up from a donor car. And I have some tricks and special tools. If booster swaps become an Olympic event I've got the gold wrapped up anyway.

 

[ReaL99]

I don't see where you guys are coming up with 45-60 minutes for the install. I pull these out of the boneyards all of the time so I could probably do the swap blindfolded with one hand tied behind my back and I'd say this is at least a 3 hour job from start to finish on a first time install. Don't forget you have to bleed the brake system. Heck it takes me at least 15 minutes just to pull the vacuum set up from a donor car. And I have some tricks and special tools. If booster swaps become an Olympic event I've got the gold wrapped up anyway.

Yeah 45-60 minute's seems like rushing it but I have never done it so I can't say what is takes the average mechanic.

 

[bmackinnon]

I don't see where you guys are coming up with 45-60 minutes for the install. I pull these out of the boneyards all of the time so I could probably do the swap blindfolded with one hand tied behind my back and I'd say this is at least a 3 hour job from start to finish on a first time install. Don't forget you have to bleed the brake system. Heck it takes me at least 15 minutes just to pull the vacuum set up from a donor car. And I have some tricks and special tools. If booster swaps become an Olympic event I've got the gold wrapped up anyway.

Agreed... :smile: I was 'bravo-ing' the intent of Bandit's message... but if he can do it in an hour.... that's worth a bravo too! :biggrin:

 

[cruzn57]

Ditto !!!!!!

us old folks have potti breaks and naps during the install,
maybe the youngsters have a special watch ( that stops for a while )
then again, behind the key board, everyone is a hero!

 

[BlackBandit]

10 min to change the whole assy and pedal??? Hmmm , I wish it took me 10 min, more like an hour from start to finish,
but then I usually check my work before I drive it, so theres never a problem,
also as mentioned, you will need vacumn source, the blocks are avail from several vendors ,
like I said, you'll be glad you changed,
good luck!

Hmm, I don't think my clock (I don't wear watches) is broken. It gets me to work on time.:wink: Maybe it's a soCal thing and everyones watch stops at the same time and no one notices. Then again, maybe you nailed it and I aspire to be the type of keyboard hero that's done it TWICE only taking an hour both times with pottie breaks.

 

[turbofish38]

I know in my old age I got halfway through the job before I reliezed I could move the seat all the way back to get more wiggle room. Figure on cutting into your nap time to remove the seat to make it easier to crawl under the dash.

 

["Turbo-T"]

Hey bmackinnon quick ? about your brake set up....lets say you're getting on it, boost is going, etc and then suddenly you let off and start braking....in that split second does the engine produce enough vacuum to operate the booster? or do you have to let the engine take a second to recover from pressure to begin building sufficient vacuum for the brakes?

 

[BlackMetal]

Hey bmackinnon quick ? about your brake set up....lets say you're getting on it, boost is going, etc and then suddenly you let off and start braking....in that split second does the engine produce enough vacuum to operate the booster? or do you have to let the engine take a second to recover from pressure to begin building sufficient vacuum for the brakes?

Their should already be vacuum stored in the booster from before you went to WOT. Any time the car is idling, vacuum is going into the booster, and the check valve prevents it from escaping.

As you accelerate, the check valve is still trapping vacuum in the booster, and prevents boost (positive) pressure from entering the booster. When you hit the brakes, there will still be vacuum to assist. UNLESS you blow apart your check valve, that's when you'll have a problem and have to actually wait for the engine to start pulling vacuum again. There are still downsides to a vacuum system like that.

 

[bmackinnon]

What he said... the vac is there before you go to boost, and remains thruout. So, no, there is no delay waiting on vac to build. I'll add that I wouldn't consider an unlikely check valve failure a 'downside' to the vac. setup.... GM's legal team gave it the green lite for the TTA... so they must have had some confidence in the system. In the event of a check valve failure, vac would return the second you snap the throttle plate closed.

 

[ReaL99]

I will not miss the Powermaster and I do mind the $300 in labor.I also would try something like this years ago.I have no expierence with the braking system and no one where I live that I know has done the conversion.The reason I need this car is because my Daily Driver was totalled 2 month's ago and I need a back up car I don't have to worry about.Sounds high to me no doubt but at least it will be done right.

 

[GSTOY]

OK did the conversion today. Found a brake pedal out of a cutlass at the wrecking yard..$10.20 Other than all the blood rushing to head and my sweat running in my eye's stinging the heck out of em, mission accomplished, not too bad. About 30 min to get it out, seat was close and I was tring to wiggle my big frame down below.

New Booster/Master Cylinder from Oreillys...$140. It should be noted, Napa, Advance and Auto Zone had nada here in OKC...could not believe it.

2 Hours later, everything installed, brakes bled. To bad I don't have a finger icon for the powermaster!! Ahhh vacume brakes ROCK!!! This is the way to go. It really is not that difficult, other than you need to be flexible..haha

Best darn mod for these cars!!!

Steve