What I learned from the gun shop in Virginia this week.

B

Bruce Urie

The Ventures,CCR forever!
Well, after reading Chuck Leeper's article about the woman in Georgia shooting that creep who broke into her home, not only saving her life, but her two children, it brought to mind what I learned in my nearby gun shop here in Virginia. And you're NOT going to like reading this, I can promise you that!

My wife, Shirley, and I stopped by there today on the way home from the airport.....I wanted to check on this new semiauto I have on order...i.e., size, fit, precision of parts, operation, bla, bla, plus pick up some Galco Gun leather conditioner.

So.........I'm standing at the counter, as the nice counterman showed me my gun I have on order..........we were taking it apart, talking about all the usual gun stuff, shooting the bull, and this fella came up next to us and told me that's an excellent gun...............good to hear......this guy carries three Berettas.....has a CCP, nice guy, giving me tips on my new gun, bla, bla.....when I just said to him : "You know, man? My gun instructor told me in class that I CANNOT shoot an intruder who has broken into my home stealing stuff..........I CAN hold him at gunpoint, but, now get this: I HAVE TO SEE THAT HE HAS A WEAPON IN HIS HAND.....otherwise, I'm in a shitload of trouble if I shoot the guy............" This guy next to me, and the counterman said, "Hell with that, I'll blow him away!!!" Which was a typical answer I've been hearing all these years.......BUT.......just a few feet away was an off duty police officer, who overheard this conversation........AND HE SAID: "Your gun instructor is absolutley right! You can't shoot him if he has no weapon in his hand...........especially if he is waltzing out the door with your TV, stereo, or anything else.............you can shoot ONLY IF HE ADVANCES TOWARDS YOU, WEAPON OR NO WEAPON, but if he turns to run or leave, I CANNOT SHOOT HIM, NO WAY." I said to the officer: "Sir, what if this sap breaks into my home at three am in the morning and is coming down the hall towards me? Can I shoot then?" He replied: "You have to yell stop, halt and point the gun at him, but if he stops, you can't fire. If he runs, after you spot him, you have to call the police, you cannot chase him at all." I said: "How about if I fire a .44 magnum warning shot through my house ceiling, will that be OK?" He said: "You cannot fire a warning shot in your house." "My OWN HOME, I CAN'T FIRE A WARNING SHOT??!!" "No, you cannot", he replied.

I said: "So if I don't have a questionaire for him to fill out at 3am in the morning on what's his plan after breaking into my house, I shoot him anyway, as it's MY HOUSE, and MY WIFE I am protecting from any possible danger." He said "You'll be in shitload of trouble, you will be arrested and taken to jail, you can only fire if you feel your life is in danger, and breaking in is not your life in danger....think of his family, he has a family, too, and if they sue you and prove you did not have legal intent or legal reason to believe that your life was threatened, then that nice Corvette out there of yours will be owned by his family, plus your house and everything in it."

With that, the fella next too me about passed out and turned beet red with anger. He looked at the officer as if he was from Mars.....and said, "I'll blow the bastard away if he came into my house anytime!" The counterman knew the officer so he just looked the other way.

So, this is the way it is in Virginia..............after all this trouble of going to gun class forever, learning all the safety rules, being a nice guy, getting my CCP, befriending the police department and now I have to be reluctant to protect my wife, or I, from harm because I have to judge FIRST if this bad guy has a weapon in his hands, or his intent..even at 3 am in the morning in the dark!!!!.....and intent is a bitch to prove.........which means if I did shoot this idiot, I'd loose all of my guitars, my GN, my Vettes, home, picks, amplifiers, tools, toilet paper, cats, wife, everything. And by being hesitant or reluctant in an emergency like that can cost me my life......sure...after I'm killed the bad guy THEN will be prosecuted. Anyone ever think that the gun laws DO NOT PERTAIN TO CRIMINALS? They don't need permits, training, high stress situations at all..........they get all the guns they want illegally and shoot anytime they feel like it....then like the cowards they really are, they RUN!

I tell you, fellas, I left that shop so damn mad and pissed. I will say, after this conversation, that the laws here in Virginia are structured to help and defend the criminal............they do nothing to protect the honest citizen.....only the police can do that.............so................

What's the damn point in concealed carry anyway in this state? Seems to me I've wasted all this time and money. And this empty suit in the White House wants even more protection for the criminals by taking away more of our gun rights......and when he puts one more idiot in the Supreme Court on his side who hates the Second Amendment, it'll be eliminated. Nice, huh? So, why carry guns at all if all I'm going to get is the shit end of the stick for just trying to protect my wife or I from harm?

End of story, but it's been heavily on my mind since.....what are your thoughts about this? Remember, it'll piss you off, but you're not in Virginia either. Other states have different laws.....like Texas, where real men can have the right to protect anything, anywhere, anytime. Why can't Virginia be like that?

Oh, boy, I'm really steamed.

Bruce '87 Grand National
 
go get a hammer out of the garage or a knife out of the drawer and put it in his hand while hes laying there in your living room at 3am. who are they gonna believe?
 
I believe California is the same way, someone can correct me here...regardless, it seems the criminals have more rights. When seconds matter in situations like that, it's really shitty to have to second guess everything when your life is on the line.

I guess the lesson here is shoot to kill, and before you call the cops make sure there's a weapon in the criminal's hand.;)
 
Now, James, Rodney, don't you think I haven't thought about that? My wife suggested the same thing, too. BUT.....and here's the true catch on this idea: Almost every, I said, ALMOST EVERY shooting incident, the shooter is given a lie detector test about the event.......absolutley true here......so, I'll have to take a lie detector test to back up my story for the detectives..........and I'm terrible at lying. When they ask me about the hammer, knife, 40mm cannon in his hands and ask if I saw him with those things, I know damn well the needle will jump into the next room through the wall.......

That's why I can't plant a weapon...........almost all shootings involve a lie detector test, I've never heard of one without one, so, now what? But good ideas, guys, and if you're damn good at lying......I'm the worst at lying in the world.........I can't even play poker, as when someone asks me if I have an inside straight, I say yes, so everyone folds.....:rolleyes:Problem is, I did have an inside straight......damn, even "Fish" is no fun.

Bruce '87 Grand National
 
Bruce Urie said:
Now, James, Rodney, don't you think I haven't thought about that? My wife suggested the same thing, too. BUT.....and here's the true catch on this idea: Almost every, I said, ALMOST EVERY shooting incident, the shooter is given a lie detector test about the event.......absolutley true here......so, I'll have to take a lie detector test to back up my story for the detectives..........and I'm terrible at lying. When they ask me about the hammer, knife, 40mm cannon in his hands and ask if I saw him with those things, I know damn well the needle will jump into the next room through the wall.......

That's why I can't plant a weapon...........almost all shootings involve a lie detector test, I've never heard of one without one, so, now what? But good ideas, guys, and if you're damn good at lying......I'm the worst at lying in the world.........I can't even play poker, as when someone asks me if I have an inside straight, I say yes, so everyone folds.....:rolleyes:Problem is, I did have an inside straight......damn, even "Fish" is no fun.

Bruce '87 Grand National
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Bruce, Bruce, Bruce...... The one thing to always remember is A "Dead Man" can not testify!

Here is Exactly what I would do and I can tell you this is also exactly what that officer would do to..

If someone Broke into my home at 3:00am and started walking down my hallway I would whisper "Stop & Halt" and then blow two shots into his chest and one in his head until he was Dead! When the cops came I would tell him he didn't stop when I asked him to, he just kept coming at me. Then when taking the lie detector test you will not be lieing because you did say stop just not loud.... :)

Here is Tennessee we don't have to worry about those BS laws, as long as an unwanted person is illegally in your home he can be shot, and my CCP instructor said to NEVER wound them because the WILL come back and sue you and now they can testify. My instructor said a Dead man can't testify against you so it's no longer his word against yours but he also said if you ever shoot anyone be sure that you will be sued by the family.

.
 
lie detectors results are not permissable in court.the law states you can not shoot a perp if fleeing. but it does not state you can not shoot the prep in the upper leg or arm. which will spin the prep around.which will keep you within youre rights to zombie kill the perp.so go to the range and practice,practice,practice. and if you ask why upper arms and legs main artterys are there and perp will bleed out.theres no time limit on calling a leo and keep a lawyer on retainer!
 
GOOD question Derrik, I believe that any good atty would be able to admit evidence regardless of state which proves them unreliable. The state may judge them to be admissable, but a jury of ones peers would certainly find otherwise after hearing 'expert opinion'. I would refuse the test on attorney advice and make them earn it the hard way, thru contempt. Then I'd have the reluctance to take an illegitimate and unreliable marker of my own self-protection noted into any casefile making admittance of the evidence of such possible.

Nobody lives when entering your home illegally.
Any weapon they may have shouldn't ever have been touched by the shooter, including in your case one possibly planted. If you know you wasted him, have the wife look whether she needs to give him one. Don't look yourself, go back to the bedroom and sit down. You're both boing to be traumatized by the event but if you're the shooter don't observe what happened or didn't after the fact. Call 911. Simply say you shot an itnruder in self defense, nothing more than your address and need of police assistance and a coroner. Don't look at a clock, the 911 call will tell the tale, and you won't know how long your wife was out of the bedroom. Hey, she went out and screamed and it sounded like she was kicking him. Women... She wasn't long.... Have that contingency clear within your home.
Say Nothing but that you shot an intruder who meant you bodily harm until representation is physically present at initial questioning.
Have that representation lined up. It will only cost you a couple hundred to see a good attorney and put a contingency plan for your possible eventual retainer and representation in place.
It seems that you as a homeowner and CCP holder are being held to the same high standard that we all expect of LEO's. Not a big deal, but it means that your respect of them requires you act as they must in your own personal actions. You cannot be held accountable for others actions and they can't unless you're capable of testifying to them.
It's a bithc but we'll all get thru it if the libtards don't get our guns. Cuz if they do, we're all instant victims of the next crime of opportunity....
 
Bruce, here in michigan its the same thing remember its the criminal JUSTICE system. Its sad that we have worry about getting sued after someone comes into our home with unknown intentions. We have the castle doctrine im not sure if most of the states have this basically states before this if someone broke into your home you had to attempt to flee? Why would i leave my home? But the castle doctrine states my home is my castle and i have the right to protect it. I am leo and it makes me very angry when good people get hemmed up for bad people. Not one person can tell you that you were in fear of your life or your families. Not one jury can tell you how you felt. You will be arrested your gun will be taken but you will have protected your familiy. I would rather be judged by twelve then carried by six. I am in fear everyday that some jerk attempts to take my life and then i protect myself while im working then i get arrested for doing my job .The. place i work for will submit a murder warrant how messed up is that . God forbid i kill a bad guy or stop someone else from getting hurt. If you have any questions i can try and help as much as i can . Oh and warning shots do it ! Id rather get a ticket or get yelled at .
 
ttaowner said:
never ever ever talk to the cops EVER !!!!!!!! lawyer up immediately !!!! that way they cant use anything against you. i repeat tell them nothing!!!
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The best advice here.

Of course with 1200 acres and a tractor plus the horses and cattle walking all over the new digsite I may not be inclined to call the cops because.....

Cops are not your friends!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They are not looking out for your best interest ever....

Mikey
 
Ill disagree ! Most people law abiding people want police to help. Cops have a job to do and are stuck by policies and procedures. Not always the cop so stop blaming them. There are good and bad cops. But the law is what dictates our actions. So again its not the cops fault.
 
In PA they have whats called the castle law. If someone is in your house you can shoot them instantly, no warning shots or yelling...but you can NEVER shoot a person in the back. You will be charged (Unless they are between you and your kids, then no judge will convict!!!)
 
Glad to live in Alabama. When a friends house was broken into the county Sheriff told us to shoot the sob and drag him back in the house. They won't ask any questions. lol
 
I think i hope most states have the castle doctrine or law. We should never have to live in fear of prosecution for keeping our homes and families safe.
 
ttaowner said:
never ever ever talk to the cops EVER !!!!!!!! lawyer up immediately !!!! that way they cant use anything against you. i repeat tell them nothing!!!
Click to expand...

...and never go and never drive yourself to a precinct to make a statement. Even though you haven't been arrested (yet) whatever they get out of you will be used against you in court. Tell them you have no comment and that isn't changing. They will try everything to make it sound like it's ok to talk. Never ever, ever talk. Nothing. No statements, no nothing. If and when they arrest you have an attorney present for all questions
 
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