Nasty lil Gremlin

[HelloBozos]

My car being the temperamental lady she is. is throwing one hell of a Fit.
She already bit the Alignment guy an got blood..heh
After thinking i have an engine issue ,(of which i just way might. still not counting it out yet)

So far I've done this below :

http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/threads/12-13-12-cause-effect-solutions-tdc-moved.388006/

Now on the 3rd ign. module/new coil pack, the car ign. stalls in 10 minutes of running time just like before.
With different XFI box it acted the same way.But. i haven't tried a different box with new Ign./coils yet. Working on that now...box's dont fall off tree's

The car with XFI 1.34 use to run Excellent. Never had an issue. Since i've sent that box to F.A.S.T. an got the 2.0 update an traction control, the car only runs for couple minutes...an that's it, you can't re-fire it for 10 minutes or more. I'm having a hell of a time diagnosing because the car was just restored. So if it's wiring issue, It could be Anywhere.(90% the front engine harness has be checked/replaced)...I'm try an get Cal out again to help me chase this gremlin down an Strangle his sorry behind...

Please post any idea's an i'll chase them down....What would cause 10 minute perfect run time to an Instant Ign./cut-off, with no re-starting capabilities?

 

[HelloBozos]

I sent my box to F.A.S.T. over the Holidays to inspect it ,they where going to put it on a car they had there to test, But...."there car was having a wiring issue"..(there other GN the motors out of it,they have 2 total currently).They sent my box back an said the settings where off,(coolent -v-s- spark) Wrong....(an if so it was because trying to tune out of the first problem,a ""bad"" brand new ign. mod.) I hope to try again with different box soon,an see if it runs longer then 10min., XFI 1.34 i had no issues. My issues started off after the restore an sending it to F.A.S.T. the first time over 6 months ago for the 2.0/traction update. my box went from red to black, an that was that...heh..I'm going to hunt down my 2.0 disk an have look into the wiring.
I went to the F.A.S.T. web site an read this below:

http://www.cpgnation.com/forum/fast-xfi-fuel-injection-installation-notes-811.html

Sure sounds like my issue in the above but i'm told it's correct as it is now...or it's a new product compatibility issue being worked out behind closed doors.Either way My cars Floor Art till it's found out...

I called F.A.S.T. today, i talk to Justin in tech, I asked for the info on there "wire issue car" . but there 'buick guy' was out an won't be back till next monday...

(story my life, hurry-up an Wait...)

 

[norbs]

This does not make sense that you can't re-fire the car after 10 minutes, when this happens, can you go and pull a plug and see if you get spark? Maybe you have other issues like a pinched fuel vapor return line bad fp etc........It could be stalling since the program is off that is all.

 

[Phoneguy]

This does not make sense that you can't re-fire the car after 10 minutes, when this happens, can you go and pull a plug and see if you get spark? Maybe you have other issues like a pinched fuel vapor return line bad fp etc........It could be stalling since the program is off that is all.

I agree...
Blow compressed air through the return line, also could be the regulator or an O ring stuck in the fuel rail. Have you checked the bulkhead at the tank? I have seen several people post pictures of their fried wires. Good luck

Bryan

 

[kidglok]

check the battery voltage when this happens. Try to get a log of it happening.

you mentioned that you tried a different box, are they different tunes? maybe the file you keep swapping is currupt??

 

[HelloBozos]

This does not make sense that you can't re-fire the car after 10 minutes, when this happens, can you go and pull a plug and see if you get spark? Maybe you have other issues like a pinched fuel vapor return line bad fp etc........It could be stalling since the program is off that is all.

Tell me about it..It's got 'Everyone' at a loss...I have brand new stainless factory type lines up front,no kinks in rubber section,(fuel pumps single reds)The programs Cal tuned in the seat the last time it stalled,so that's not it. It's an Ign, Stall without the possibility of a restart, Fuel's good,solid 45psi (vac. hooked up) on the rail gauge,Volts ( i think,but i'll be running that down next,brand new rebuilt 210amp alt.) are ok, because everything else works but the Ign. when it happens.The battery's in the truck now, so i could be missing a wire to it that when it was in the stock location got moved in the restore job...I'm still hunting.I'm busy till Thurs,(girlfreind got pulled over for 07' sticker 3 weeks ago,8^/,time go to court) then i'm up to the shop/on the phone/bugging Cal...(like your build by the way!, i like people that try different things,or get things to work that shouldn't)
Forgot i took plug photo already...brand new ngk-r's ur5's or 4's, thought i went to 5's now

 

[HelloBozos]

I agree...
Blow compressed air through the return line, also could be the regulator or an O ring stuck in the fuel rail. Have you checked the bulkhead at the tank? I have seen several people post pictures of their fried wires. Good luck

Bryan

New lines in front only, stocker's along the fuel rail still, drained all the fuel before the first ever re-start an added 10 gall new 93,(wires should been fine,the shop would of told me if they saw hokeyness, new fuel filter,..It has XPR1 intank (single reds pump hot wired).It was red's volt boosted, but trying to finger this all out, i removed it an bought casper factory splice connector again to return it to factory.(brown one wire connector) It's not fueling issue, it's a pure Fire issue, or at least the command of it.

 

[Phoneguy]

Take a mirror and look at the bulkhead just to eliminate it, if the pump pulls too many amps it will melt the factory wires in the bulkhead and overheat the pump. Easy enough to check and eliminate. Log the run in the XFI and see what it shows. Seems like something is getting too hot if it wont start for 10 minutes.

Bryan

 

[HelloBozos]

check the battery voltage when this happens. Try to get a log of it happening.

you mentioned that you tried a different box, are they different tunes? maybe the file you keep swapping is currupt??

Thats next on my list,why is the Ign. loosen juice?...the Different box's, Cal was in passenger seat, tune swapped over from his comp., an then re-defined again, (Cal tuned my car couple years ago, it's the same combo,just with a painted car now,my files,,,heh on file....) When the car stalled again, nothing could be done to re-start it. Only time waiting will till "something cooled back down" (but we din't swap the box over again after that,thats next thing i could try)....Car did the exact same thing with Julio in the pass. seat from Alky systems, All the usual collprates have been looked at many time over now. Why i can't figure it out... The car runs Great cold, vroom vroom you can rev it,then Zip, nothing...afriad to road test it again becuase that got me an Julio stuck in the middle the road for 10min. heh, opps..

 

[HelloBozos]

Take a mirror and look at the bulkhead just to eliminate it, if the pump pulls too many amps it will melt the factory wires in the bulkhead and overheat the pump. Easy enough to check and eliminate. Log the run in the XFI and see what it shows. Seems like something is getting too hot if it wont start for 10 minutes.

Bryan

Yep, heat related, I'll look into that, Question., Can the Gray (or it might of been Gray with black stripe,i'll look again Thurs.) wire coming out of the stock wiring harness under the car in the back behinde the fuel tank go straight to the battery in my trunk? That's how it is now, It could be overheating the pump, but i have Fuel everyone says.An thats not the issue. Sure looks funky to me though.
This on the list to check:
http://www.installationinstructions.com/102028.pdf

 

[TurboBuRick]

Any log files of when this happens?

 

[87turbot-type]

A log would really help to see what is happening when this happens. Heat can do funny things.

Brandon.

 

[norbs]

ALl you have to do is pull a plug wire after it wont start and see if you have fuel pressure or spark, when you crank it.

 

[Mike Licht]

Check your balancer bolt and make sure it is tight. I had a car that I worked on for days doing the same thing. When running the balancer would walk out and lose spark after about 10 min. Enough cranking pulled it back in enough to start. A long shot but worth a quick look.

 

[bison]

ALl you have to do is pull a plug wire after it wont start and see if you have fuel pressure or spark, when you crank it.

Do this before looking elsewhere. If you have fuel, spark, and compression something will happen. You don't have one of the 3 if it doesn't start. Moving this to general tech since it's a crank but doesn't start. If it turns out that the solution was related to the aftermarket ecu I'll move it back.

 

[TurboTGuy]

Check your balancer bolt and make sure it is tight. I had a car that I worked on for days doing the same thing. When running the balancer would walk out and lose spark after about 10 min. Enough cranking pulled it back in enough to start. A long shot but worth a quick look.

I wasn't going to mention it for fear of being chastised and called crazy, but back in the 90's when I had my GN I had the same sort of issue Hello is dealing with. Chased that thing for weeks!

It turned out be a cracked harmonic balancer that would cause the same symtoms. (probably happened during re-installation after some previous upgrades) When it would get hot enough it expanded the crack just enough to make the crank sensor be off enough to shut the car down.It wouldn't start again until it cooled off enough. It happened in the winter/spirng months in Phoenix when the temps have 30-40 degree swings from morning until dusk so it was intermittent and it drove me crazy!

I kept having it towed to my buddy's shop and he wouldn't believe me because he would get in the car and it would start right up, until one night he went with me when I drove out to the strip, made 4 or 5 passes and on the way home BAM, the thing just died for no reason, AGAIN.

We towed it to his shop and I had a new converter I wanted to install at the same time. When we went to use the serpentine belt to turn the engine so we could get to the top converter bolt, guess what became apparent?

Yep, That thing flexed about a half an inch...........

Got it fixed and the car got stolen out of my driveway a week later........

Good luck with that gremlin! I hope you find it.

 

[HelloBozos]

Do this before looking elsewhere. If you have fuel, spark, and compression something will happen. You don't have one of the 3 if it doesn't start. Moving this to general tech since it's a crank but doesn't start. If it turns out that the solution was related to the aftermarket ecu I'll move it back.

Got fuel, when it happens i got erratic spark, got compression, Holly's sent me an extra XFI box to try again.Get's here tomorrow. I can get " something" to happen, but it's not Correct...

 

[HelloBozos]

Check your balancer bolt and make sure it is tight. I had a car that I worked on for days doing the same thing. When running the balancer would walk out and lose spark after about 10 min. Enough cranking pulled it back in enough to start. A long shot but worth a quick look.

Checked it, an for cranktrigger ring play,rubber's still tight on it too.Bolted up tight. Was one the first things we looked at.

(sorry about your theft, i had 3 guy's try it to me one night after the bar, they got a AR-15 in the face an all 3 scattered...lol, cops got one with the helicopter later)

 

[HelloBozos]

ALl you have to do is pull a plug wire after it wont start and see if you have fuel pressure or spark, when you crank it.

It has Fuel, It has spark, just not SFI controlled spark after the problem hits...You can get the car to run after the problem, but only totaly retarted.If i had no spark at all, it won't run at all. 3 differant coil pack/ign. mod. try's. one being Bad from the start,(wouldn't run right at all) other origianl (runs perfect for 10min), other brand new one,( runs perfect for 10 min.).I have extra XFI box coming in to try, if it don't work long then 10min., it's back to the drawingboard.

 

[norbs]

If you have spark this means the crank sensor is working ..........can you send a log of this or post it on here. Sounds like its going into timing bypass mode, bump the timing up and down in the spark map and see if the motor runs any different, rpm should increase as you increae the timing. You may want to unplug the IAC during the test, but don;t unplug it with the key on.