Time to go Stage II!

[Alky V6]

That is good news on the headers, I will use 304 bends, but I have a new rod to try er-347, supposed to take more heat before corrosion. Another question what is the max lbs/min on that 91 mm turbo you have?

The 91mm doesn't have any concrete compressor specs. It's a custom variant of the B/W Airwerks S510 that uses a 95mm compressor inducer. The 95mm does have a compressor map and specs. For the 95mm it's 165.
Forced Inductions did the turbo. They advertise that the turbo is capable of supporting 1650 hp. Without a compressor map for the modified compressor wheel it's hard to confirm that.

 

[norbs]

I think your in for a big surprise at the high boost levels/rpm, with the heads and the flow potential, you have opened Pandora's box!

 

[Alky V6]

I think your in for a big surprise at the high boost levels/rpm, with the heads and the flow potential, you have opened Pandora's box!

I like surprises.

 

[750H.P.V6]

Are you going to run Titanium valves in the Stage II heads?

Neal

 

[Alky V6]

Are you going to run Titanium valves in the Stage II heads?

Neal

Yes. Intake and exhaust.

 

[norbs]

What are you going to use for valve seat material?

 

[750H.P.V6]

Probably Berillium Copper that seems to be most common.

Neal

 

[Squid4life]

Yes. Intake and exhaust.

So, I guess you answered your own question from my TI valve thread. You are stepping up as the guinea pig!?

What is your plan with the valve setup? Run what is in the heads currently? Buy new TI? Run those TI for a season and replace, as you said in my other thread?


I remember you said keep it under 1400, so I assume your EGT's with the alcohol stay well below that? Again, very interesting.

750H.P.V6 said: ↑

Maybe they should have run a Ti exhaust valve too.

Neal​

I guess someone could try it and let us know how it goes. Any ginny pigs out there?

 

[turbofabricator]

So, I guess you answered your own question from my TI valve thread. You are stepping up as the guinea pig!?

What is your plan with the valve setup? Run what is in the heads currently? Buy new TI? Run those TI for a season and replace, as you said in my other thread?


I remember you said keep it under 1400, so I assume your EGT's with the alcohol stay well below that? Again, very interesting.

750H.P.V6 said: ↑

Maybe they should have run a Ti exhaust valve too. ​

​

Neal​

I guess someone could try it and let us know how it goes. Any ginny pigs out there?

Donnie, go with Inconel exhaust valves. Don't even try Ti exhaust valves. No gain unless you plan on over 1o,000 RPM. At your power level, you are going to have issues with heat. I have never heard anyone ever using Ti on a turbo charged engine. They stretch too much. We ran hi dollar stainless, and they would stretch. Ti is much worse. Good luck with your project. But, I am willing to be proven wrong. Turn the RPM up to 9800 and watch it run. Wooo Hooo.

 

[ttypewhite]

Nice, I look forward to seeing the project under way. Don't know if this is an option or not, but just a mere suggestion on my part. Try and keep it all under the hood in this build and slap another stock hood on the car. It would make the final project look so much better giving the car already has a sinister stance. Good luck.

 

[Alky V6]

What are you going to use for valve seat material?

Neal's correct. The heads are already setup with beryllium copper seats. That is the preferred seat material for use with Ti valves. Good heat transfer properties.

 

[Alky V6]

So, I guess you answered your own question from my TI valve thread. You are stepping up as the guinea pig!?

What is your plan with the valve setup? Run what is in the heads currently? Buy new TI? Run those TI for a season and replace, as you said in my other thread?


I remember you said keep it under 1400, so I assume your EGT's with the alcohol stay well below that? Again, very interesting.

750H.P.V6 said: ↑

Maybe they should have run a Ti exhaust valve too. ​

​

Neal​

I guess someone could try it and let us know how it goes. Any ginny pigs out there?

James, I don't know if you realize it or not, but I've been running Ti intake AND exhaust valves since 2005. When running methanol, the exhaust temps get up to the high 1300s. I don't expect to get over 1400.
I will be buying new Ti and the exhaust will be heat barrier coated, as were my last set. It is recommended that you change out the valves every season. The company that supplies my valves were sure to make that very clear to me. I don't always follow recommendations. That doesn't mean the recommendations aren't sound. In your thread, I simply wanted to make sure everyone had all the information pertinent to running Ti valves. What they do after they have all the information is up to them.

 

[Alky V6]

Donnie, go with Inconel exhaust valves. Don't even try Ti exhaust valves. No gain unless you plan on over 1o,000 RPM. At your power level, you are going to have issues with heat. I have never heard anyone ever using Ti on a turbo charged engine. They stretch too much. We ran hi dollar stainless, and they would stretch. Ti is much worse. Good luck with your project. But, I am willing to be proven wrong. Turn the RPM up to 9800 and watch it run. Wooo Hooo.

Like I told James, I've been running Ti in both positions since 2005. I have noticed that the head of the exhaust side has a tendency to warp very slightly, but when they see seat pressure they seal. They seem to be rather pliable in that way. I did change out all the valves once. I think I let them go for 2 to 3 years before I changed them out. The second set had coated exhaust valves. The coated valves have much less tendency to warp.
I will be watching exhaust temps with this new build. If they get out of hand, I'll change out the exhaust valves for Inconel.
An interesting note. The valve adjustment clearances have remained very, very stable over the past few years. I'll check my notes and put up some real dates to that comment.

 

[Alky V6]

Nice, I look forward to seeing the project under way. Don't know if this is an option or not, but just a mere suggestion on my part. Try and keep it all under the hood in this build and slap another stock hood on the car. It would make the final project look so much better giving the car already has a sinister stance. Good luck.

I'll try to do that. Or, I'll try to at least get it tucked down so it's not popping out so much like a hemroid.

 

[norbs]

I would just do it once, and go inconel, why go through all the labour to do it again? gaskets etc?

 

[Alky V6]

I would just do it once, and go inconel, why go through all the labour to do it again? gaskets etc?

RPM!!! That's why. Along with overall valvetrain durability.
Lighter valves means lighter springs. Less mechanical loading of the overall valvetrain.
In any case, regardless of what exhaust valve material I use, I will be tearing this build down immediately after a few breakin runs just to see how things are wearing. This engine will be PM'd on a much more regular basis than my Stage I. The price to pay for more hp. More inspection and maintenance.

It's not common to see a methanol engine, even a 2500 hp methanol engine run exhaust temps into the 1400s. That's a direct sign that the engine is running too lean. Alcohol engines are very individual in what they like for an exhaust temp in relation to maximum power. Some will make max power at exhaust temps colder than high 1300s. We'll just have to wait and see what this build likes. To tell you the truth, when I have bothered to glance over at the exhaust temp gauge, I never caught anything even in the high 1300s with this Stage I build. It has always been lower. Which is just fine. I was already receiving more power than I could use. There was no reason to try leaning it out any further.

 

[Alky V6]

I checked the maintenance log for the race GN. These are the latest entries that pertain to the lastest few valve adjustment procedures that were done to the engine. You can see I didn't check the valves very often.

1-8-10
Valve adjustment. All valves good at .014-very tight .015". No valves needed adjustment. Day temperature was 75F. All springs between 170-180 psi.
Trans experiment abandoned. New TC stator installed.

4-13-10
Valve adjustment. All valves good at .014-very tight .015". No valves needed adjustment. All valve springs good. Day temperature was 75F.
New 9.5" TC installed. Stalls at 3200 off nitrous and 4850 on the 364 shot.
393 shot installed. I predict a 1.31 or 1.32 60 foot.
1 ex 175, in 170
6 ex 180, in 180
5 ex 170, in 170
4 ex 180, in 180
3 ex 185, in 180
2 ex 170, in 170

2/16/11
Spark plugs changed. #6 showed very little heat. Most likely due to #6 having a lot of leakdown.
Best for the car in the 1/8 was on 2/12/11.
.511 reaction
1.277 60'
3.629 330'
97.66 mph
5.576 660'
126 mph

2/18/11
Valves adjusted at ambient temp of 15.8C.
All valves checked to be .013". No adjustment necessary.
The engine was rotated to between TDC so that no springs were at max compression during storage of the car.

 

[750H.P.V6]

I was reading an article in Hot Rod where they were giving a breakdown of the engine Kenny Duttweiler built for the Speed Demon which is a Streamliner for Bonneville. It runs on Methanol and makes around 2000 H.P. although they claim to be running an Iconel exhaust valve the pic of the head appears to have Copper Berillium seats on the intake and exhaust.

Neal

 

[Alky V6]

I was reading an article in Hot Rod where they were giving a breakdown of the engine Kenny Duttweiler built for the Speed Demon which is a Streamliner for Bonneville. It runs on Methanol and makes around 2000 H.P. although they claim to be running an Iconel exhaust valve the pic of the head appears to have Copper Berillium seats on the intake and exhaust.

Neal

The heads that I have where copper seats are being used, both seats are copper.

 

[Alky V6]

Mike (BlownV6). Here are the numbers on the heads I plan to use. I was mistaken about this particular set being new. It is a used set. Bronze guides. Copper seats. Beautiful port work.
Intake port volume: 245cc
CC volume: 45cc

On the rocker pads, both heads;
prog/1810
FE/01/90

On the center exhaust port flange areas, both heads;
000
9018R