CHECK your injectors! E85 injector gunk

[TA49-WE4]

Looks as if there is a problem going around of gunk build up on the injectors with people running 100% E85. ( Not everyone is having this problem just some )

The evo boy's seem to be having the same problem. So it is not car specific just fuel specific.

There thread can be found here. ( lots of good info )

Read this thread.

Injector "gunk" and E-85 - evolutionm.net

Yes! I am having the same problem . I have attached pictures. The gunk seems to be just on the injector ends and it is on the intake runners of the heads also. But I see nothing on the fuel rail side of injector or anything in the fuel rail. ( 2500 miles on injectors )

I did not have any problems with this until I started running e85. So it is fuel related.

Seems to be the only answer so far is to run a few tanks of straight 93 through your car from time to time. ( Reason being is that supposedly this stuff cleans off easily with gasoline ). I can not confirm that.

However that is what im going to try this summer and see if it helps.

Just wanted to give everyone the heads up to check your injectors!!!!!

 

[Hot Air]

Is this "gunk" the gunk that was laying in your fuel tank from the last 20+ years of gasoline useage? I have always hear to expect this....i.e., change out your fuel filter frequently when you first start running E85 as it WILL clean out your fuel system!
Conrad
Hot Air

 

[Hot Air]

One more though...is the fuel filter plugged up and bypassing fuel around the filter media? Have you changed the fuel filter lately? Have you cleaned out the "gas" tank? It is possible to do!
Conrad

 

[blackmonte]

I sold some 60# injectors I used E85 in them for over a year and they looked brand new I am thinking there had to be other problems involved ?

 

[TA49-WE4]

Is this "gunk" the gunk that was laying in your fuel tank from the last 20+ years of gasoline useage? I have always hear to expect this....i.e., change out your fuel filter frequently when you first start running E85 as it WILL clean out your fuel system!
Conrad
Hot Air

There is nothing in the fuel rail or on the injector on the fuel rail side as you can see in the picture. Its just on the end on the injectors thats in the intake.

There are evo cars that are having the same exact problem and these cars are way newer cars and some of them are brand new. Totally diffrent cars than are's the only thing thats the same is the fuel ( E85 ) and a turbo setup and they are getting this same gunk on there injector tips also. It has to be deposts coming from the fuel when mixed with heat/oil.

Yes I have changed the fuel filter. I did it once when I swithed over to E85 and once a while back. Im thinking I will take the one off the car and cut it open. That will answer the question is it coming from the gas tank. Im thinking its going to look just like the fuel rail. Sweaky clean.

 

[TA49-WE4]

This is a picture of a 2006 evo's injectors. These have about 2k miles on them. They are FIC 1150's. Also I am using e85 compliant fuel line, fuel rail, and FPR on this setup. ( Taking from a thread at evolutionm.net )

This is the same gunk thats on my injectors. ( Only thing in common I have with this car is we are both running E85 and a turbo setup )

 

[Chuck Leeper]

Looks like...

either corn syrup, or melted rice hulls.

 

[jdpolzin]

Any chance it could be from deteriorating rubber fuel hoses? When I pulled the gas tank on my brothers car, the factory hoses were pretty rough. The Ethonal is going to clean any worn rubber.

 

[TA49-WE4]

Any chance it could be from deteriorating rubber fuel hoses? When I pulled the gas tank on my brothers car, the factory hoses were pretty rough. The Ethonal is going to clean any worn rubber.

All rubber fuel lines on my car are new. Even the ones on the front of the car that attach to the engine. ( classic tube ) I changed them when I put the xp double pumper in around 4000 miles ago.

Im going to take the fuel filter off tonight and im going to cut it open tomorrow. I will post pictures of it.

 

[jdpolzin]

I'd be interested to see what you find. Looking forward to pics!

 

[skew]

e85 crud???

after 2 years of e85 there is nothing in my fuel system! changed the fuel filter after a year of e85 and cut it open, it was cherry! this was a stock paper style. I was going to take a pic and post it up. injectors also looked mint when they came out to upgrade. I have not seen any of these myths of rubber lines falling apart or tanks corroding or injectors crudding up. I might just have a clean fuel system and got lucky. I was blown away by the fuel filter condition after running e85 for so long on a stock style filter. Everybody said it will destroy it in no time! I will take a pic of the fuel filter that is in the car now after I open it up, going to upgrade to al fuelab stuff.

 

[TA49-WE4]

Ok here are the fuel filter pictures.

Its Sweaky clean just like the fuel rail.

 

[skew]

fuel filter

it looks like the filter was coming apart at the base? mine had a light dinge to it, but did not look like yours! where do you get your e85 or is it e98? I get mine from gas city. I have had no problems.

 

[blackmonte]

+1 Gas city here as well, I have never cut open my filter but I do change it every year.

 

[TA49-WE4]

it looks like the filter was coming apart at the base? mine had a light dinge to it, but did not look like yours! where do you get your e85 or is it e98? I get mine from gas city. I have had no problems.

The base looking like its coming apart is from the cutting wheel hitting it when I was cutting it open.

I used this tool.

 

[bison]

This is a picture of a 2006 evo's injectors. These have about 2k miles on them. They are FIC 1150's. Also I am using e85 compliant fuel line, fuel rail, and FPR on this setup. ( Taking from a thread at evolutionm.net )

This is the same gunk thats on my injectors. ( Only thing in common I have with this car is we are both running E85 and a turbo setup )

Another thing in common is both applications run a alot of backrpessure which allows hot inert gases to flow backward through the valves during overlap and vaporize any lingering liquid fuel. Im guessing the gunk is from the additives they add to the gasoline part of the E85 when the fuel boils off. Has anyone proven that this is causing a spray pattern problem? if not i wouldnt be too concerned.

 

[TA49-WE4]

Another thing in common is both applications run a alot of backrpessure which allows hot inert gases to flow backward through the valves during overlap and vaporize any lingering liquid fuel. Im guessing the gunk is from the additives they add to the gasoline part of the E85 when the fuel boils off. Has anyone proven that this is causing a spray pattern problem? if not i wouldnt be too concerned.

That is a very good possibility that this gunk is coming from inert gases flowing backwards though the valves during overlap.

This problem so far by my research is limited to cars that are running 100% E85 in the tank ( every tank ) for over 2500 miles on high boost engines.

I do belive that this is going to cause a spray pattern problem. Look at this picture. ( This is off of my car )

 

[Chuck Leeper]

Looks like

That is a very good possibility that this gunk is coming from inert gases flowing backwards though the valves during overlap.

This problem so far by my research is limited to cars that are running 100% E85 in the tank ( every tank ) for over 2500 miles on high boost engines.

I do belive that this is going to cause a spray pattern problem. Look at this picture. ( This is off of my car )

oil residue to me...
If it's a common reversion problem, why are not all injs dirty??
Could be, the alky is being used in such large qtys, that there's some cyl wall, valve guide wash down, causing oil burning?
If I were burning this fuel, I'd want to know what's in it to help w/ guide, cyl wall lubrication...

 

[TA49-WE4]

oil residue to me...
If it's a common reversion problem, why are not all injs dirty??
Could be, the alky is being used in such large qtys, that there's some cyl wall, valve guide wash down, causing oil burning?
If I were burning this fuel, I'd want to know what's in it to help w/ guide, cyl wall lubrication...

All the injectors on my car had this gunk on them. Just diffrent amounts some had very very little and some had alot.

Im going to run a catch can on my pcv valve this summer to try and cut down on the oil in the intake. Also going to run some additive in the tank this summer and see what happens. Its going to take all summer to do the research tho. Takes some miles for this stuff to build up.

Funny you should say something about whats in the fuel. I'm going to head out to the ethanol plant today and ask that very question about whats in the ethanol as far as cleaners etc.

Picture below is of the other injectors that were not so bad on my car.

 

[Chuck Leeper]

Alky additive..

I started w/ alky injection when Steve S. first came w/ a kit. He recommended a spritz of WD to help w/ pump lube.
When I raced the fe rail, I used 2 qts of Klotz in a 55 gallon drum of meth...
It'll be interesting to hear, [IF they'll even tell you], what's in the corn likker they make....
It would also be interesting to see what the internals of the engine look like after, say 20K miles on 85 or even 98....[The rail got an oil change every weekend.]
How about running the engine for a oil change interval, then pulling an oil sample?? Could be interesting!
W/ the methanol, the interiors of the anodized fittings were totally void of anodizing color, in about 2 weekends. This was also a problem for the braided hose w/ rubber lining. It got "harder than the back of Superman's head" in 1 season..