New best Holley
- Thread starter THensley
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- Joined
- May 28, 2001
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Also just looked again.. Dropping into and out of closed loop.
You can uncheck any of the traces on the log.
Try to deactivate some and look at only rpm, the closed loop, afr commanded and actual.
I'm wondering if the alky system is being sucked dry and messing with the afr.
Is it using a lot of alky?
Maybe turn the boost down, kill the alky, and see if AFR commanded and actual are close.
You can uncheck any of the traces on the log.
Try to deactivate some and look at only rpm, the closed loop, afr commanded and actual.
I'm wondering if the alky system is being sucked dry and messing with the afr.
Is it using a lot of alky?
Maybe turn the boost down, kill the alky, and see if AFR commanded and actual are close.
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- May 25, 2001
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You might want to take a look at your fuel table, it is pulling 30% fuel in 1st and 2nd gear. At about 2.2 seconds in the fuel flow jumps around 176lbs/hr when it goes open loop.
thanks Chuck for your time and help.These 6 passes were the first WFO pulls and you are correct it is rich. Now I have 1 saved log I can try to find the other 5 in the computer to compare.
I have closed loop correction on because my WFO fuel table was not a very educated guess
But in the lower RPM rang that part of the fuel table is very close.
Im logging ALKY PSI and it appears to be tracking good with the boost.
the timing table and AFR table is a copy of my 6.1 TT chip took hours to extract that data. ALKY pump is new and tested good. ALKY is back to the default settings as a starting point. Now I try to decide to remove ALKY,Fuel or add timing.
Thanks you too TType yes the table is just a guess using Holley setup info so I need to work on the higher boost and RPM portion of the table after I hit post I'll post the tune.
Like I said the timing and AFR is off the TT chip Its not in stone so Im going to revisit AFR at ALKY turn on, like I said above there is options to fix the rich spots
Im not convinced that 3 or 4 Dyno pules will tell me much more than what I have today
I have closed loop correction on because my WFO fuel table was not a very educated guess
But in the lower RPM rang that part of the fuel table is very close.
Im logging ALKY PSI and it appears to be tracking good with the boost.
the timing table and AFR table is a copy of my 6.1 TT chip took hours to extract that data. ALKY pump is new and tested good. ALKY is back to the default settings as a starting point. Now I try to decide to remove ALKY,Fuel or add timing.
Thanks you too TType yes the table is just a guess using Holley setup info so I need to work on the higher boost and RPM portion of the table after I hit post I'll post the tune.
Like I said the timing and AFR is off the TT chip Its not in stone so Im going to revisit AFR at ALKY turn on, like I said above there is options to fix the rich spots
Im not convinced that 3 or 4 Dyno pules will tell me much more than what I have today
- Joined
- May 25, 2001
- Messages
- 1,668
This area of the fuel map is an issue:
The red numbers are because there is not enough fuel to support that ve% In my tune it is a closer to 100 but my tune still needs work in that area.
Your learn table from your lower boost runs looks like it was pulling 30% out. I wouldn't pull all 30% out of the table at one time in the tune, maybe 10% at a time and see where the correction is going.
I am sure there are a lot more people who know a lot more than me that can look at it but that is just some things that stood out to me. I think once you get the tuning in line there is a 10 and the missing mph there
Another question is why did it drop out of closed loop? Looking at the log/tune again it looks like it hit your low rpm over-rev which I think will pull it out of CL. It also looks like there could be other situations that have to do with noise or AE fueling but my guess it the rpm limit.
The red numbers are because there is not enough fuel to support that ve% In my tune it is a closer to 100 but my tune still needs work in that area.
Your learn table from your lower boost runs looks like it was pulling 30% out. I wouldn't pull all 30% out of the table at one time in the tune, maybe 10% at a time and see where the correction is going.
I am sure there are a lot more people who know a lot more than me that can look at it but that is just some things that stood out to me. I think once you get the tuning in line there is a 10 and the missing mph there
Another question is why did it drop out of closed loop? Looking at the log/tune again it looks like it hit your low rpm over-rev which I think will pull it out of CL. It also looks like there could be other situations that have to do with noise or AE fueling but my guess it the rpm limit.
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your correct that is one bad looking learn table.But out on the road steady driving in Open Loop its beautiful under 2500 and 0 boost
Yes lower boost is a mess and I have been methodically working small parts. With this log I'll be able to make a better guess at the numbers.
If I can get the new wheel bearing from Mark Willams this week and get it back together ill return to track nov 15th Good thing I do all my work and don't need to rely on some shop.
Yes I see that but my new numbers in the table have come down to 103
Yes lower boost is a mess and I have been methodically working small parts. With this log I'll be able to make a better guess at the numbers.
If I can get the new wheel bearing from Mark Willams this week and get it back together ill return to track nov 15th Good thing I do all my work and don't need to rely on some shop.
Yes I see that but my new numbers in the table have come down to 103
I would need to see the global file
And the log of the run and would need to know what holley he is on and the version
That can be emailed to me if the op wants me to see it he can pm me
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- May 25, 2001
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He has them in post #26. It loaded on my V6 software
ok I see several things.
5900 to 4361 is the 1/2 rpm drop
1600rpm indicated to tight
272bs of fuel=means no power
bump in the track or a miss in the motor at 8.85 afr right out of the blip before 60ft and on the 1/2 shift as you didn't lift
Computer is taking all the fuel out it can because you are flooding the motor 30%through the entire 1st gear.
You are leaving with the alky on and where the blip is on the track or miss in the motor in the 60ft range the alky is at 147lbs of pressure.
the alky shoots straight up immediately and requires a different ramp.
the 2/3 drop 5800 to 4600rpm so 1200 rpm drop.
which is indicating not tight enough.
After the 2/3 shift 8.45 afr at 27.9pis of boost and Computer is still taking 30% of fuel out
Meaning it's super rich
meaning because the motor is being hit with so much alky for the horsepower it makes there is no way to truly determine if the converter is right or can be.
Also the red numbers in the holley mean there is not enough injector to hit the commanded afr.
So my conclusion is there is too much alky too soon.
If the car could hold a solid afr throughout the entire run i would say at least .5 sec et possible.
5900 to 4361 is the 1/2 rpm drop
1600rpm indicated to tight
272bs of fuel=means no power
bump in the track or a miss in the motor at 8.85 afr right out of the blip before 60ft and on the 1/2 shift as you didn't lift
Computer is taking all the fuel out it can because you are flooding the motor 30%through the entire 1st gear.
You are leaving with the alky on and where the blip is on the track or miss in the motor in the 60ft range the alky is at 147lbs of pressure.
the alky shoots straight up immediately and requires a different ramp.
the 2/3 drop 5800 to 4600rpm so 1200 rpm drop.
which is indicating not tight enough.
After the 2/3 shift 8.45 afr at 27.9pis of boost and Computer is still taking 30% of fuel out
Meaning it's super rich
meaning because the motor is being hit with so much alky for the horsepower it makes there is no way to truly determine if the converter is right or can be.
Also the red numbers in the holley mean there is not enough injector to hit the commanded afr.
So my conclusion is there is too much alky too soon.
If the car could hold a solid afr throughout the entire run i would say at least .5 sec et possible.
Your curve should come in later and with less overall pump pressure
Before you do that
I would flow the 60lb injectors and make sure they are good
Bumping the fuel pressure will bring the numbers out the red on your injectors on the map.
But the computer is doing it's job
8psi and up your at 22 degrees roughly
You could use more timing there.
Especially if you plan on keeping the alky high early.
Before you do that
I would flow the 60lb injectors and make sure they are good
Bumping the fuel pressure will bring the numbers out the red on your injectors on the map.
But the computer is doing it's job
8psi and up your at 22 degrees roughly
You could use more timing there.
Especially if you plan on keeping the alky high early.
Also if you could control your boost better you would have more consistent alky pump pressure(yours is all over the place because of boost fluctuations)throughout the run therefore being able to maintain a commanded afr.
Then you can actually see what the converter is doing
Then you can actually see what the converter is doing
Thanks Mr. Spool for your time
1.The blip just before the 60 I believe is tire spin, then hook. the VSS needs work to be smoother and more accurate. (On the FIX list)
2. The 1-2 shift hit the Main Over-Rev Limiter it set 6200 high 5950 low SOFT. I believe
3.Yes it is way rich on fuel and its time to recheck the ALKY PAC settings, blue knob is set at 6.
4. I have been using this log and making changes in the fuel table (small) need the look at the PAC settings and try to deal back the ALKY. I have read over the form, Tuning the ALKY a few times and getting a better understanding of it before I go turning the internal controls.
5. I have not changed the down pipe to a better boost controller with C02 as per an early recommendation.
This car needs work and Im working at it. I made 3 passes that night before I went back to logging with laptop, I keep thinking it was logging but I could not find them in the ECU. Its a HP. I should have did that after the first time with no data.
I like your advice in post 32 Yes the injectors are over 10 years old and never been cleaned our checked, This has made me think that maybe I might consider upsizing them to overcome the shortfall in the fuel table (red numbers) I was aware that raising fuel pressure would fix it , but wanted a few loges to see where I was. If injectors need work I might switch to E85, But need to do more research on the E85 in my area.
This would take ALKY out of the equation too.
The 60's should be able to support a 10.5 power with ALKY. and 10.5 is probably the end of the 5857 too. And would E85 be something you one would use for a 10.5 car.
I will need a bigger fuel pump too and posable fuel lines to support 80's or 95+ for E85 All to consider.
Got a set of plugs but need to get 6-8 passes first before I put them in and get fuel closer first.
But I like the advice about the injectors being checked, This needs to be my next move I'll be removing them tomorrow to ship out. After I get the results back I'll try to make a good move in the right direction.
1.The blip just before the 60 I believe is tire spin, then hook. the VSS needs work to be smoother and more accurate. (On the FIX list)
2. The 1-2 shift hit the Main Over-Rev Limiter it set 6200 high 5950 low SOFT. I believe
3.Yes it is way rich on fuel and its time to recheck the ALKY PAC settings, blue knob is set at 6.
4. I have been using this log and making changes in the fuel table (small) need the look at the PAC settings and try to deal back the ALKY. I have read over the form, Tuning the ALKY a few times and getting a better understanding of it before I go turning the internal controls.
5. I have not changed the down pipe to a better boost controller with C02 as per an early recommendation.
This car needs work and Im working at it. I made 3 passes that night before I went back to logging with laptop, I keep thinking it was logging but I could not find them in the ECU. Its a HP. I should have did that after the first time with no data.
I like your advice in post 32 Yes the injectors are over 10 years old and never been cleaned our checked, This has made me think that maybe I might consider upsizing them to overcome the shortfall in the fuel table (red numbers) I was aware that raising fuel pressure would fix it , but wanted a few loges to see where I was. If injectors need work I might switch to E85, But need to do more research on the E85 in my area.
This would take ALKY out of the equation too.
The 60's should be able to support a 10.5 power with ALKY. and 10.5 is probably the end of the 5857 too. And would E85 be something you one would use for a 10.5 car.
I will need a bigger fuel pump too and posable fuel lines to support 80's or 95+ for E85 All to consider.
Got a set of plugs but need to get 6-8 passes first before I put them in and get fuel closer first.
But I like the advice about the injectors being checked, This needs to be my next move I'll be removing them tomorrow to ship out. After I get the results back I'll try to make a good move in the right direction.
Please help this is the number I was given. These are LS coils D510's AC Delco Not Amazon lookalikes
That's the default settings.
We build the dwell time maps as part of the tuning.
The dwell can be increased there too
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