What intercooler are you running and for what reasons have you made this selection?

[TURBOELKY]

We already covered this. Real time cooling is minimal. Adding mass is the easiest way to increase cooling but adding to the pass reduces flow. Doubling the pass with no other change cuts flow in half. If pressure drop exceeds 1-2psi then it's too much. It's easy to reduce charge temps by making a more restrictive design. I've got data from two cars that dropped charge temp 40* by switching Intercoolers and didn't pick up any power. One actually slowed down. Unfortunately he didn't have the hot boost pressure. If charge temp is dropping and you aren't picking up power at a rate of about 1% per 10 degrees you are likely introducing a restriction somewhere. Weight should be a consideration also especially with air to air which is hanging off the front of the car.


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Would it be safe to say, too small of a turbo with a large intercooler would affect performance? Is it possible the switch to a different intercooler exceeded the turbos capacity to function within its rpm range?

 

[bison]

Would it be safe to say, too small of a turbo with a large intercooler would affect performance? Is it possible the switch to a different intercooler exceeded the turbos capacity to function within its rpm range?

No. the turbo supports mass flow and mass flow is of primary concern. Not air flow (unless it's inadequate). But too big as in adding weight that is unnecessary will slow down the car but from actual power unless it's causing some kind of restriction it won't matter


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[TURBOELKY]

So we do understand cold air is dense, and hot air is less dense. While I'm sure there is a very complex formula to show just that, I am not a scientist. With that being said, if you have a thick core that does not cool the charged air as well as a narrow core, how would the larger charge of hotter air vs lesser mass but of more dense cooler air charge affect efficiency?

 

[No disintegrations]

So we do understand cold air is dense, and hot air is less dense. While I'm sure there is a very complex formula to show just that, I am not a scientist. With that being said, if you have a thick core that does not cool the charged air as well as a narrow core, how would the larger charge of hotter air vs lesser mass but of more dense cooler air charge affect efficiency?

Would you rather have a hot air turbo Buick or an non turbo with cool air temps? Even hot boost is better than no boost. More slightly warmer boost is better yes?

 

[TURBOELKY]

Would you rather have a hot air turbo Buick or an non turbo with cool air temps? Even hot boost is better than no boost. More slightly warmer boost is better yes?

 

[bison]

So we do understand cold air is dense, and hot air is less dense. While I'm sure there is a very complex formula to show just that, I am not a scientist. With that being said, if you have a thick core that does not cool the charged air as well as a narrow core, how would the larger charge of hotter air vs lesser mass but of more dense cooler air charge affect efficiency?

We've already covered this. You can't just look at the air temps. The turbo is doing work. When you increase the work you need to get extra exhaust energy to do it. That comes at a huge expense when trying to increase mass flow. Especially when you are running out of turbo. The core thickness and pass need to be at an acceptable ratio to not restrict flow and get the most cooling. Since there is little real time cooling most of the actual cooling is heat sinkage into the core.


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[TURBOELKY]

We've already covered this. You can't just look at the air temps. The turbo is doing work. When you increase the work you need to get extra exhaust energy to do it. That comes at a huge expense when trying to increase mass flow. Especially when you are running out of turbo. The core thickness and pass need to be at an acceptable ratio to not restrict flow and get the most cooling. Since there is little real time cooling most of the actual cooling is heat sinkage into the core.


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Has anyone played with spraying a cooling agent such as alcohol at the inlet of the intercooler? I know it's corossive on aluminum but that would actually cool the hell out of the intake charge, while still injecting alcohol post intercooler.

 

[~JM~]

By any chance does anyone have the pressure differential & temperature differential numbers for the RJC IC-325 FMIC?

http://rjcracing.com/product/intercoolers/product-details/

Thanks.

 

[Nigel]

Has anyone played with spraying a cooling agent such as alcohol at the inlet of the intercooler? I know it's corossive on aluminum but that would actually cool the hell out of the intake charge, while still injecting alcohol post intercooler.

With a good intercooler, I don't think you would see a benefit. With the turbo high exit temps the alky will want to flash(good), but you are not likely to get it all to flash before entering the intercooler(bad). The max temp drop would be down to the alky saturation temperature low 200s(good), but I doubt you have the time to see that(bad). Practically all of the drop will come from the latent heat of vaporization(good). Once in the intercooler, the alky is going to want to precipitate out, and the latent heat of condensation will have a negative effect on cooling the air stream(bad). You will have wet flow through the intercooler and it could end up puddling some where. If you had a hot air, it would be a big benefit, or if you had a marginal intercooler might be a benefit. You can always experiment.

 

[Boost231]

By any chance does anyone have the pressure differential & temperature differential numbers for the RJC IC-325 FMIC?

http://rjcracing.com/product/intercoolers/product-details/

Thanks.

Be nice to start a thread with someone just testing them in a controlled environment like Richard Clark did with the intakes

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[~JM~]

I searched a long time ago & didn't really find much info other than some data from testing done back when the printed newsletter was around.

I don't think RJC was around at that time.

 

[bison]

Be nice to start a thread with someone just testing them in a controlled environment like Richard Clark did with the intakes

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Be nice to get anything at all from anyone. Only a few actually had any useful data when I asked them. Knowing the cars mph/weight, hot boost pressure, exhaust pressure, and manifold pressures on a log would help a bunch.


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[TURBOELKY]

Be nice to get anything at all from anyone. Only a few actually had any useful data when I asked them. Knowing the cars mph/weight, hot boost pressure, exhaust pressure, and manifold pressures on a log would help a bunch.


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That's because most of us are just full of hot air

 

[bison]

That's because most of us are just full of hot air

Believe it or not hot air may be the best solution for a lot of racers with ethanol fuels.


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[TURBOELKY]

Believe it or not hot air may be the best solution for a lot of racers with ethanol fuels.


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Why don't you leave the small stuff alone and just go nitromethane? Run all the boost the turbo can put out and the engine can handle. Zero detonation issues if ran properly, and it's only a little toxic...

 

[~JM~]

Here is a link to that newsletter test info: http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/bob_dick.htm

Here is another article on testing a larger SLIC: http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/0104-htp-mease-performance-intercooler-test-calculations/

I realize that none of the IC's listed above can compare with the new design being discussed in this thread.

 

[bison]

Here is a link to that newsletter test info: http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/bob_dick.htm

Here is another article on testing a larger SLIC: http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/0104-htp-mease-performance-intercooler-test-calculations/

I realize that none of the IC's listed above can compare with the new design being discussed in this thread.

Key data missing.


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[~JM~]

I know... But that was about all that I was able to find before & still.

You would think that more data on differential pressure & temperature would be available.

 

[forcefed3.8's]

I am going to test no intercooler on my 8 sec tsm car on e85 next spring

 

[Royal-T-Ltd]

Key data missing.


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That was the newsletter I was referring to. I found my other issues... for some reason I can't locate that specific copy. Anyway I'm glad someone else mentioned it. It sucks that it's missing some data that might be beneficial to this thread.
aaron


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