What would you do: Brake failure.. Downshift or Reverse?

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

Last weekend i was racing in noble oklahoma and everything went fine.

Once i unloaded my car off the trailer, the REMAN powermaster plastic reservior broke.

First thought that went thru my mind was, WOW, i just got done racing, how lucky am i to have it fail AFTER i was done.

So, i got to thinking, what would i have done if the powermaster had failed and i was traveling 120mph???

First i would have hit the ebrake, but i dont think that would have stopped the car.

Park would surely break the transmission, and 2nd gear would scatter the motor..

What about reverse?


What would you do?

BW

 

[Junior Samples]

Man thats a tuffy, id prolly stick my head out of my moon roof, let my tongue wag like ratfink and scream like a girl.

Good thing ya made it back safe though, all kidding aside id like to think i would shut car down, hit e-brake then try and outtacontrol steer with no P/S

 

[Boost231]

Man thats a tuffy, id prolly stick my head out of my moon roof, let my tongue wag like ratfink and scream like a girl.

Good thing ya made it back safe though, all kidding aside id like to think i would shut car down, hit e-brake then try and outtacontrol steer with no P/S

LMFAO. i would shut the motor off hit the ebrake and if all else failed i would down shift it when i could. 2nd then first.

 

[86brick]

Fred Flintstone?? Seriously my brother had something similar happen when he had his old GN. Took it to Moroso one night to make some passes and the POS PM failed while we were in the tech line. It was pretty scary to think about the "what if's".

Think I would downshift. If that worked I would get out and change my pants! LOL

 

[Dreamcar86]

I am not sure anyone knows what they would do until they were in that situation but shutting the motor off is the first thing that comes to mind. Throwing the car into reverse would most likely be a very violent move. Hopefully the track would be long enough to shut the engine down and hit the e brake.

BTW - that is what happened at BG this year to a GNX and his outcome was not pretty.

 

[Boost231]

I am not sure anyone knows what they would do until they were in that situation but shutting the motor off is the first thing that comes to mind. Throwing the car into reverse would most likely be a very violent move. Hopefully the track would be long enough to shut the engine down and hit the e brake.

BTW - that is what happened at BG this year to a GNX and his outcome was not pretty.

yup i remember the pics of the car. wonder how the restore is coming along.

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

Yeah it had me scratching my head, what if the brakes failed...

I was able to replace the reservior with a 20 year old piece, brakes work fine still and i caught it just in time too. Talk about good luck!
What a pain getting the original one apart, the new one litterally fell apart, i think the new plastic piece is thinner

I think i would opt for the ebrake and reverse.

Has anyone just gone with manual brakes?

BW

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

I dont think it was BG where the GNX wrecked, i thought it was the ohio event?

BW

 

[red83]

e-brake would be fine with downshifting, if you had rear discs i would think.

i dont think drums would be to happy. they seem to give up alot after they heat up.

but i am no brake expert. i own a small trucking company and all big trucks have drums all the way around. after they heat up the brake material crystalizes. and when you take the drums off the material is in small pieces. i have seen this happen on new brake changes when an inexperienced driver is on the brakes to much

 

[notacarlo]

Spring loaded deck lid - air brake.

Reverse would stall the engine wouldn't it?
If it comes to going home to see my kid and wife or scattering an engine block, I will downshift and ebrake. OR rub the wall to a stop.

 

[TNTBuick]

Turning off the engine would lock the steering column. Reverse is equal to or lower than 1st gear and would lock-up rear wheels and destroy engine and trans. Maybe ebrake while progressivley downshifting?

 

[johnplogii]

Downshift and E-brake while holding the release. Prayer would probably be a good idea at this time also.

 

[Dreamcar86]

If it comes to going home to see my kid and wife or scattering an engine block, I will downshift and ebrake. OR rub the wall to a stop.

Good point!

 

[BlackMetal]

Has anyone just gone with manual brakes?

BW

I know a few guys on these forums have converted and say that they like it. I've been considering it just because there's less chance of failure than the powermaster, no check-valves or leaks to worry about like with the vacuum setup, no extra plumbing and not as expensive as a hydroboost conversion.

Obviously not ideal on a daily driver but for a cruise night car or track car, I think a manual set-up might be an inexpensive alternative to relying on the powermaster to save your hyde.

 

[A2000RICH]

Last weekend i was racing in noble oklahoma and everything went fine.

Once i unloaded my car off the trailer, the REMAN powermaster plastic reservior broke.

First thought that went thru my mind was, WOW, i just got done racing, how lucky am i to have it fail AFTER i was done.

So, i got to thinking, what would i have done if the powermaster had failed and i was traveling 120mph???

First i would have hit the ebrake, but i dont think that would have stopped the car.

Park would surely break the transmission, and 2nd gear would scatter the motor..

What about reverse?


What would you do?

BW

about the powermaster------even if the reservior were cracked it is likely that the unit should be good for a stop or two----------it the fluid were lost from the inside chamber (largest of the three) the unit should still have braking but will require much greater pedal force to stop the car since this would only disable the power assist-------i have seen numerous folks think they have lost brakes in a TR due to powermaster failure when they still had "non power" brakes and only needed to really "stand on the pedal" --------the car should also not totally lose all braking with loss of fluid from the 2 outer chambers (front and rear brakes) since the level of fluid would still probably cover the inlet to the power piston-----if you have ever bled brakes you know that there are no problems as long as the fluid level always covers the inlet port and it doesn't suck much air-------the fluid displacement is not that great with a single apply UNLESS your brake system is severly worn and cylinder/caliper displacement is larger than normal-------it would take at least a couple brake applies to exhaust this remaining fluid------its not like a major leak in the brake lines past the master cylinder where you lose the ability to build pressure------BUT if the brakes are really dead the transmission/ebrake can do fairly well-------as for the transmission------if you are going fast put the shifter in D (not overdrive) since OD has no engine braking but drive does--------you should turn the ignition off and floor the gas since this enables air to be sucked into the engine at max and will increase pumping losses that drag engine speed and slow the car faster--------at a good time you should shift to 2 and then to 1---------and of course while doing this the parking brake should be engaged but be careful with this since the car may have a tendency to want to spin and bring the rear end around if the rear tires lock up------be ready to modulate the pedal and feather the release lever----you can always "throw it in park" gear when it gets down to less than ten miles per hour or so without doing too much harm--------but i doubt you will find it necessary----------i too am aware of what can happen when the "problem-master" fails-----------i have practiced this exact drill till i can do it without thinking about it in case i ever need it-------it works pretty good.............RC

 

[Silver 'T' Top]

Hope my insurance is up to date!!

 

[GNguy]

i would throw it into park or tbrake....better to lose the trans then the car. good thing my cars down.

 

[six is enough]

Reverse might not be a good idea. There is a reason N.H.R.A. mandates a reverse lockout. Last year a car at a local track would put his car in neutral at the end of the quarter. Well he hit reverse by accident and rolled the car. Not a good idea to lock the rear end up when you are running to fast. I think downshifting might be better.

 

[noslo6]

Noble

I was at Noble too, and my first pass I blew the hose off my vacuum brakes. I had a hard pedal when I crossed the line @ 124mph I got her stopped with some muscle of the pedal, but my first thought was OH SH!T

 

[JDEstill]

when I was about 17 I was coming up to a stop sign at the busiest road in town, another car stopped at said stop sign. Gave it some brake pedal to start slowing down and the pedal just went to the floor and no braking at all! I had about 2 secs before I rear ended the other car at ~30-35 mph. No time to think at all. Whipped around the other car, jumping over a median, out into the busy street, didn't get nailed (thank God), pulled into the center lane and started coasting downhill. Still unthinking and very shocked, I just put it into park. (E brake never crossed my mind) It didn't immediately lock up, it went grind-grind-grind-grind for a while as it slowed to down, then about 5-10 mph hour it finally caught and jerked to a stop.

Similar thing with rental car antics at Bowling Green a few years back (not me and not my rent car! I was just an innocent passenger!) Cruising down 231, what's the name of the road, Scottsville?, 40 mph or so, and driver just shifts it to park. It just went click-click-click-click for a while, slowed the car a little, we laughed, then he shifted it back to drive and we kept on cruising. No real drama.

So, in my experience, downshifting and e-brake are going to work a LOT better than shifting to park. Hopefully I'll have the presence of mind to do that if ever faced with the situation again.

Oh yeah, cause of failure in the first story: cotter pin that holds the brake pedal onto the lever broke. Pedal came off the post and just flopped to the floor. After I figured that out I just put the pedal back on and drove on home, careful not to put any kind of side load on the pedal so it wouldn't fall off again.

John