Why Are HotAir Cars Slow?

[cool 84]

Lacking Air volume / Flow.

Heat soak.

Constricted exhaust.

If someone wants to shoot for some previously unseen performance I believe they will be found in the latest E-85 fuel. Higher octane, and burns much cooler. Little to no carbon buildup on pistons and valves... it is a sweet deal. You pay about $1 less for it than pump Premium too.

We have some good posts on this subject in our local Colorado Street racing board The Colorado Racing Network

Board Message <--- E85 Thread

Who bought Marka's T-type? I understand it was up for sale a few years ago. I wouldn't state that her turbo was "stock" because it was modified. The housing itself was "stock." There were other mods on that car as well. If the rules allowed it... why not? If there is a gray area... take advantage of it. :biggrin:

I purchased one of the first set of V2 intakes to come out... a handful were configured for front mount intercooled. Personally... to those of you who are "waiting" for such a set up I encourage you to just give in to converting over to the '86/'87 intake setup. The downfall of the V2 setup is it still retains the stock '84/'85 downpipe configuration. You gain more exhaust flow by converting over to a larger 3" downpipe in the '86/'87 configuration and don't risk your knock sensor going off everytime the '84/'85 setup smacks your frame or firewall. There are plenty of V2 pics on the MSN website.

The problem with E85 that no one likes to mention is your gas mileage drops by nearly 50%.

 

[Boostnitup]

50% is a myth

When you look at the price of Race Fuel and E85 side by side it becomes an easy choice. The question is... Is it available and located anywhere near you? That isn't a concern for me in Colorado and I do intend to use it.

You lose somewhere between 15 and 25%... not sure where you got that 50% number from but it is way off.

 

[turbo6x2]

But from my understanding (just had a friend convert his car to run E85)you can't just run this in your car without changing your fuel lines, upgrading your injectors and doing something different in the gas tank otherwise the E85 will cause issues. And I would think tuning would need to be done as well??? I know he had to add a lot more E85 to get the car to run properly.

 

[Boostnitup]

Alot of myths being perpetuated.

Check out National Ethanol Vehicle Coalition

 

[turbo6x2]

The Energy Policy Act of 1992 also recognizes E85 (a blend of 85% ethanol and 15% unleaded gasoline) as an alternative fuel. In order to operate on E85, vehicles need to be compatible with alcohol use. The conversion cost to make FFVs compatible with E85 typically includes upgrades to the fuel system components, the addition of a fuel sensor, and reprogramming the EPOM (computer chip) in the ECM/PCM (electronic control module/power train control module).

This is directly from the site you have posted.

 

[Hot Air]

I thought E85 was 85% gasoline, 15% ethanol! Wow. This will take major mods to run this stuff. Guess the market for 100+ lb/hr injectors will really take off if this becomes an economic reality!
Conrad Carter

 

[jwillettgn]

well my guess is we need a bigger turbo. theres stock block 87s run 9. i know theres one that runs 8's but that would be far from stock even thow it uses a 109 block. anyways if you look at the basic setups the only thing becides the intercooler then have is a very large turbo. maybe we need to get more air in there once we open everything up.

We have a bigger turbo.

My son (Zacks 85GN) and I got the second V2 kit from Jay (Turbomotion) before he switched the TB to the intake inlet. He had us send it back to move the TB to the intake and that is when all hell broke loose between Turbomotion and S&S Turbo Regal. Well never got the intake back but did get our money back, thanks Jay. We were going to be one of the test cars and I had John Craig build us a custom turbo to mount in the stock location. John listed it as a TA-61 and it ended up costing us $1200.00. We still have this turbo NIB and plan on using it on our converison that we hope to have running soon. I would of really liked to see what it would of done on a real hot air with an opened up intake. We have thought about selling the turbo as we really need a 70 series for what we are doing but money is tight right now.

Jim

 

[Boost231]

TA-61 humm. where does that fall in at. whats the RWHP rating on that turbo? i think its rated at 575 rwhp if i remember right. thats still off compared to what im talking about. the turbo im running right now is rated at 610 and im trying to step up to a TA-66 thats rated at 720 but im having to figure some issue out first.

 

[jwillettgn]

Not sure what it really is as it is custom, John just called it a TA-61 on the paperwork. Here are some pictures.

 

[Boost231]

hey can you email me those turbo pics. i cant view them here since im in the desert my email is Boost231@hotmail.com i would really like to take a look at them.

 

[tb3]

jwillitgn,

How much are you trying to get for it if you decide to sell?

 

[turbo6x2]

It looks just like my turbo he built me a few years back.

 

[Saladin45]

So in all honesty, mid to low 11's is really the fastest that hotair's have gotten so far?

 

[Boost231]

11.20's with a 3.8 and 10.8* with a 4.1

 

[Saladin45]

Alright, thanks for that.

11.20's. That sounds pretty good. That's not a slow car by all means.

Now this is my thing. Is it the frame of the hotair's that holds them back from having certain things put in them? Or is it something mechanical?

 

[Boost231]

not sure what you mean. the 84-87 are identical except the way the motor is designed. You can bolt all the 87 conpontes as far as the motor go and you will have the power of a 87. the difference in the cars is basicly the intake up. The heads down is the same from 84-87. Slight casting difference in the block but nothing that will increase or decrease power.

 

[Saladin45]

Yeah but, the 87 naturally is faster than the 84.

I mean, 87's and 86's are the ones you hear about going into the 9's.
Not 84's and 85's.

So you tune your car right, you put on all the necessary parts, but it still won't be fast enough to break that 10 second barrier. Do you see what I mean?

 

[Boostnitup]

There are more differences than "intake on up"

The exhaust configuration is different. The exhaust on the '86/'87 cars flow better than that on the '84/'85 cars.

Not needle picking here...

'86/'87 cars were running 13.80's on a cold day at sea level... and the '84/'85 cars were busting out mid 15's. You figure it out. Those differences between the two cars indeed added up.

If you have access to dyno time... and the free money to put your "Hot-Air" car on a dyno you could dial in a nitrous system, and meth injection or propane system and will probably see those covetted 11 second et's.

 

[Saladin45]

Now here's something.

What if you like tear out the engine block, the turbo, and everything and just throw in a totally different engine, turbo and whatever else is necessary.

Like, a 383 Stroker, a powerful turbo (You choose), and whatever else is necessary. Then nothing stops you from having that ability like the other GN's, right?

And let's walk away from the idea of money being a problem.

I'm talking like, maybe this being a 5 year project or something. So think about it, wouldn't that work?

 

[Boostnitup]

Going V8?

The purist's will go nuts on you.

They will state you could grab a normal V8 Regal and modify it instead of a T-Type or GN.