Fuel mileage and overall cost of burning E85

Hot Air

E85 and S.E./Carolinas Moderator
Staff member
Nov 11, 2002
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Durham, North Carolina
Donnie,
Are you getting biodiesel confused with E85? French fries.....nothing to do with E85! Were you racing the Oldsmobile Cutlas that has a Duramax diesel under the hood?
Conrad
 

Grumpy

Thread killer
May 24, 2001
10,779
489
83
Andover, Ma
so what are you guys running for times with Buicks on E85 ??? Ya I am an "Alkyholic" and wondered about E85 mileage to. Don't know of any E85 gas stations around here.
 

Hot Air

E85 and S.E./Carolinas Moderator
Staff member
Nov 11, 2002
3,072
28
48
Durham, North Carolina
Check out the Stickies for details. Some are running very low amount of E85 and have done little to their car and have gotten away with it. Just be sure your stock fuel system is in top-notch condition. As a minimum, I would drop the tank and be sure the sock is in good condition and upgrade the fuel pump. Also, run hot wire to the fuel pump so you get full voltage to it. Of course, your injectors must be clean and in great condition. You have changed your fuel filter haven't you! Would be wise to change it again after running E85 for a while since it will clean out your fuel tank, lines, etc.

If you go to high % E85, you will need a bigger fuel pump, fuel lines (?), fuel filter, and injectors. Your fuel system will have to supply 30% more fuel and, if you turn up the boost, somewhat more pressure. Be sure your fuel system is capable of handling the extra load! Oh yes, you will need a E85 chip or FAST or ????

Conrad
Hot Air
 

1outlaw

New Member
Jan 19, 2010
77
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Central Wisconsin
For you folks with aftermarket mods the experience will be different (I have seen modded usually end up with higher consumption diff for safety) but here is my experience in my personal vehicle and my fleet of FFV's;
*2001 S10 2.2L FFV with autotrans-- 16.6% more E85 at interstate speeds. 12-15% on 2 lane hwy. The 4 cyl heats up faster than the next vehicles and this helps it. Also this vehicle has a real ethanol sensor (vs today all are algorithm) and I suspect the open loop mapping is more dead on than the conservative rich algorithm types. Guys with stick shifts get far better mpg than I do but I suspect the gap of E85 vs gap is only closed slightly.
*2005 Taurus FFV 214,300 miles -- range in differentials is 15-20% more E85- average approx 19 %. All but approx 20-22,000 miles in this vehicle has been E85.
*2006, 2007, 2008 Impala's -- these guys (all 3.5L FFV) all have a range of 18-22% more fuel for E85- with the average at 20%
*2007 Silverado 5.3L FFV- sorry- driver does not keep good enough records on this one though the same engine has varied from 12% in many 2002-2003 models to 25% in some of the recent (2004-2009) doing short trip or pulling trailers according to my customers.
*Non-modified 2004 Saab 2T Aero. Since this guy calls for premium (AON 90 min.) I use E20 since it is far cheaper, is 91 octane, easy E20 is available, and per my repeated trials there is no mpg diff 70 mph hwy between E0 premium, E20, and E27.5. No issues over the 3 year peiod used.
*Rest of my stuff (2000 5.3L Yukon XL, 1996 5.7L Silverado, and 2001 Saturn SL2 (now retired due to wreck) all have a steady diet of E20 with no noticeable mpg differentials but the fuel records and drive cycles on these make real mpg comparison more difficult))

Here in WI the price spread where I buy is never worse than 18% and rarely better than 32% -- average is approx 22%. As such our small fleet runs on E85 at all times.

Hope this helps.
 

EyesofThunder

New Member
Jul 3, 2008
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I am figuring this will be a bad summer for high gas prices again, they are $2.75 for gas and $2.67 for E85 in the WINTER (yes, they keep raising the E85 price), and it is January. They gave us a summer off from stupid high, now it will come back by the look of things.

So I am hoping to get my fat injectors and try again on E85.

But my experience is the lower compression engines (<10:1) just don't have enough mechanical efficiency to make E85 truly cost effective. My LT1 on the other hand, loves E85, I get around 15-17 mpg with E85 and 17-19 on gas. I can't complain at all.

Get it hot, heat the intake air and warm the fuel all help a LOT to get better E85 mpg without really hurting power compared to gas.
 

1outlaw

New Member
Jan 19, 2010
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Central Wisconsin
I do not know how long it will be before they are available but Delphi has been testing heated fuel injectors. In Brazil where Hydrous E100 (no gas but 5% water) is used I suspect these will take off quickly. Here in the USA where we have anhydrous (dry) ethanol mixed with up to 30% gas for cold start the perceived need is less and govt inhibits fast adaptation. That said however- there may be movement to adapt these to improve cold start/ warm-up period emissions by reducing overfueling and ignitability. Fuel rail electric heaters are another way to skin this cat but need longer on-time pre-start (injector heaters are only approx 1-2 sec).
 

blackmonte

New HP Technology !!!
Jan 9, 2007
1,791
1
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50
Barrington ,IL
just took a drive today
see sig
20.2mph on e-85 that included few WOT pulls:biggrin:

the key seems o be keeping afr around10-1 or a lil leaner at cruise
so far so good!
-dan
Your running a FAST with yours right? What are you keeping your AFRs just cruising around?I have mine set-up Maft Pro for 15.5 and could tell right away that I was burning way less fuel just wondering how lean I can go to be safe cruising around?
 

EyesofThunder

New Member
Jul 3, 2008
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Interesting. I'll dig around and see what I find on them.

Edit: http://delphi.com/pdf/techpapers/2009-01-0615.pdf

I do not know how long it will be before they are available but Delphi has been testing heated fuel injectors. In Brazil where Hydrous E100 (no gas but 5% water) is used I suspect these will take off quickly. Here in the USA where we have anhydrous (dry) ethanol mixed with up to 30% gas for cold start the perceived need is less and govt inhibits fast adaptation. That said however- there may be movement to adapt these to improve cold start/ warm-up period emissions by reducing overfueling and ignitability. Fuel rail electric heaters are another way to skin this cat but need longer on-time pre-start (injector heaters are only approx 1-2 sec).
 

bonecheck

workaholic
Jan 29, 2010
32
1
8
36
Texas hill country
so...

i've got a low compression engine and i'm considering an upgrade to e85. Anyone out there convert an almost totaly stock car? if i were to upgrade total fuel system(pump,lines,injectors,conversion kit, everything) what am i looking at $??

oh ya- and stroking it out a bit
 

Ttype6

Well-Known Member
Aug 17, 2004
3,296
243
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Flint,Michigan
if you do the proper mods to the fuel system does e85 produce more HP and TORQUE than 94 and alky on a 600 hp plus motor
It would have to. It is 35% oxygen by weight. Even if it didn't,It's awesome the way the turbo spools. Oxygen bearing fuels such as ethanol,methanol,nitro methane,and Q-16 always produce more power than non-oxygenated gasoline.
When we introduce the air we breath into the motor it is only 22% oxygen. The rest is inert/space wasting nitrogen and some other gasses. We need 11-12 parts of oxygen to 1 part of fuel for good power. That's a lot of wasted/useless gasses entering the motor and taking up space.If we can introduce a gas that contains a higher amount of oxygen(nitrous oxide) or sneak oxygen into the motor in the fuel we will make more power.
 

Texas gn

Member
Jan 14, 2011
475
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18
San Antonio
E85= Performance….How much? I have read several threads about the performance gains but no numbers. Does anyone have dyno results before and after?
 

charlief1

RIP Charlie!
Sep 20, 2007
20,982
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No Where But TEXAS!!!
E85= Performance….How much? I have read several threads about the performance gains but no numbers. Does anyone have dyno results before and after?
I don't have any specific HP/dyno numbers but I can tell you that there's 1 HA car that's still a HA and it's running E-85. So far her (yes it's a lady;)) has gone into the 10's and no intercooler has ever been used on it.:D Turbo6x2 is her board name and her name is Jamie.:cool:
 
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